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[Music]

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hello

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and welcome to the show i'm martin

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wilsher host and

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this year marks the 60th anniversary of

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the betty and barney hill

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incident happened in september

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and we are lucky enough to have uh

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betty's uh niece

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kathleen martin on um kathy we were

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talking ahead of the show

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she was on her early when i started this

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podcast

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um almost 10 years ago now uh so she was

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on early i went to her

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where she was at in newburyport mass and

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uh

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recorded with her was back when i was

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not doing live shows at that time

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but anyway um it's always a pleasure

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having her on she's a

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very nice woman and uh you can actually

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talk to her later tonight well because

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at the

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last half hour of the show we'll be

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taking calls and

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speaking of calls next week it's all

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calls

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it's all about you um it's a call-in

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show

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and i'm always a little bit nervous

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doing the call-in shows this is going to

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be my second one

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i think i did half of one one time so

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maybe one and a half

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but um so next week if you want to call

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in talk about

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an experience you had uh ufo related

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please

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or uh topic along those lines um and

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the lines will be open bill will be

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screening them

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and so i'd love to hear from you next

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week

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and that's going to start the usual time

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as it is right now 6 p.m eastern

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standard time

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uh saturday i'm going to be popping in

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at the big phone home that

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that banner is on my website

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podcastufo.com

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and we are going to have luke uh

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luis that is uh call in uh about

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uh another i don't know 50 minutes from

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now or so he's going to be on the show

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he's going to be with us through the

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break

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as well um and he's gonna be talking

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about what that is all about

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and that's coming up this saturday and

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um he

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is a a great guy he came kind of out of

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nowhere

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i was the actually he asked me on the

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show early on in his show

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and i always like to say yes because

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that's how i started someone said yes

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and so i'll be uh talking to him later

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on

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over at our website it's uh

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the blog this week is called ufo ejects

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metal over iowa

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and check that out another great blog

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from charles

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lear um i don't usually get too personal

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about things that are going on um in my

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life but i

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i did want to talk about this real

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quickly and

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there is a reason i'm talking about it

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and that is uh

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tomorrow morning when i get up and i

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look at the clock at eight o'clock

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i will be uh fully vaccinated because i

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had my

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shot uh it'll be two weeks ago wednesday

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and uh you know it's not a big deal i i

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think the more we get vaccinated the the

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better off we're gonna be in this

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country i have a

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very close family member that did every

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single thing

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right for an entire year and uh

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his friend that he lives with stepped

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out for one hour

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one hour uh two or two and a half weeks

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ago

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and now he's suffering with uh kovid

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right now

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and i just think it's real important um

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that we get vaccinated

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and uh it's not a big deal it doesn't

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really hurt

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if that's the problem and you know some

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people do get a little bit sick but

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it's a lot better than uh covet because

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we don't know the lasting effects of

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covert

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covid and where that will go um it could

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affect the brain the lungs

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the heart and all that there's a lot of

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things we just don't know yet

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i'm hoping we can get through this thing

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together and get back to some normalcy

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and the only way we're really going to

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do that is if we all work together and

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anyway that's it i don't like talking

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politics or

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anything like that unfortunately it has

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become politicized a lot

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but uh let's just uh we're in this

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together and let's uh get through it

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together

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and i want to thank everyone that

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listens to the show

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and i want to thank everyone that

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supports the show and uh we are ready to

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bring in our guests now and thank you

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for

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letting me save my uh you didn't have

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any other choice really

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for me to give my opinion on this but

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here is uh kathleen

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welcome to the show kathleen thank you

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martin nice to be back with you

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yes it wasn't wasn't it like close to

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nine years ago when you were i mean it

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was right near the beginning of my show

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i believe right

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yes i thought i had done the first

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show but maybe not i know it was a

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little bit in the

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in i i remember exactly what you said

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you said that if

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stan friedman says you're okay then

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you're okay and you're welcome to my

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house

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that's what you said stan had been on

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your show then

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yeah i was staying with my father it was

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during the summer in newburyport

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massachusetts

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that's right yes and uh and

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we missed stan i know you were very very

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close to stan

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yes he was a friend yeah

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that's right and a co-author actually

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mentor in the beginning yeah yeah

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and it's it's sad because every time i

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go into a conference

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there you and stan were together you

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know sitting together talking with your

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books and all the people around you and

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all that

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uh he will be uh he is very missed

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yes and uh what what a great legacy

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he did a lot of great things for the ufo

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world he did he certainly did

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yeah and so how did you how did you

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first

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just i know it's off topic of betty and

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barney hill but not really

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how did you first meet stan and and

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you know get involved with writing that

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book and everything

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well i think that i met him for the

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first time

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in december of 1971

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but wow really that long ago yes i think

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that he

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uh spoke at the university of new

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hampshire

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and and i went to see him there but then

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uh over the years i got to know him

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because of my interest in ufos and

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particularly because of my aunt and

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uncle's case

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and so i was a big fan of stanton's i

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enjoyed going to his lectures at ufo

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conferences

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i always went to the mufon ufo

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conference

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and and he was usually a speaker

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and so i spent years

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researching my aunt and uncle's case i

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started in

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1990 and uh very slowly over

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investigated and investigated

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investigated spoke with all of the

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original researchers i could find

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spoke with other researchers my husband

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and i drove the route that betty and

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barney

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took on that fateful trip i went to the

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white mountains with betty over and over

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again

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and with my husband as well and

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uh you know i had written a

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manuscript betty knew that i was

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writing about her she approved of it uh

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she gave me the hypnosis tapes which i

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transcribed for comparative analysis

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which i did

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for the book and then uh

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it came to the star map and

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when i do research i don't base it on

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somebody else's findings i want to do

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that research myself that's the kind of

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researcher

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that i am and but

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i didn't want to spend two or three

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years

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researching the star map and doing all

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of that

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astronomy and so uh stanton

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was involved in that from the beginning

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when marjory fish had finally

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uh found a pattern

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in her work over a four-year period

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and stanton was called in to vet

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marjorie's work

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by coral lorenzen who was the direct

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co-director of the

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aerial phenomena research organization

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and so

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uh i went to stanton

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at the mufon symposium and

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uh asked told him that i'd been writing

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this book

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and told him that i had betty's entire

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collection she had passed at that time

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i was the trustee of her estate

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and uh was setting up an archival

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collection for the university of new

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hampshire

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and uh stanton found my

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what i was saying to be interesting and

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said before he would agree

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to work with me by writing the chapter

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on the star map and also

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a chapter on debunkers and disbelievers

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then he wanted to see

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my collection and so he came to my house

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i was living in stratham new hampshire

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at that time and my husband and i

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had him for a few days while he went

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through the collection we

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talked at length i thought we'd never

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stop talking

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and uh finally uh he read the manuscript

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that i had written

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and he he said because i was being

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scientific

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and unbiased uh in my work and he liked

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the quality of my work he agreed

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to work with me and so i thought it was

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just going to be

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for for that book which was uh published

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in 2007

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but we began our work together in 2005.

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and yeah and and we just discovered that

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we enjoyed working together and

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we spoke at conferences sometimes from

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the same stage

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we always shared vendor tables and

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realized

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that we liked one another he was easy to

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get along with he made me

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laugh a lot and yeah and uh he thought

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that i was funny too

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and and so we had a good time working

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together

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and he asked me to write another book

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with him and and i said yes i'd

285
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i'd be happy to do that uh he it went so

286
00:11:41,430 --> 00:11:39,040
smoothly the first time

287
00:11:42,630 --> 00:11:41,440
and then we wrote a third book together

288
00:11:44,949 --> 00:11:42,640
as well so

289
00:11:46,470 --> 00:11:44,959
um the second one was science was wrong

290
00:11:49,430 --> 00:11:46,480
the third one oh yeah

291
00:11:51,509 --> 00:11:49,440
fact fiction and flying saucers i think

292
00:11:53,990 --> 00:11:51,519
i might have them all possibly

293
00:11:54,629 --> 00:11:54,000
um i want to show this to the youtube

294
00:11:57,110 --> 00:11:54,639
people now

295
00:11:59,350 --> 00:11:57,120
isn't that that's betty's drawing right

296
00:12:01,269 --> 00:11:59,360
yes it is she even signed it

297
00:12:02,550 --> 00:12:01,279
yeah i can see it on the right yeah and

298
00:12:05,190 --> 00:12:02,560
uh and this is

299
00:12:05,670 --> 00:12:05,200
the star map right here how close is

300
00:12:10,470 --> 00:12:05,680
that

301
00:12:13,110 --> 00:12:10,480
identification

302
00:12:14,230 --> 00:12:13,120
um stanton found the three scientists

303
00:12:16,550 --> 00:12:14,240
who vetted

304
00:12:18,069 --> 00:12:16,560
marjorie's work and said that it was

305
00:12:21,910 --> 00:12:18,079
accurate

306
00:12:23,269 --> 00:12:21,920
and uh i think one angle was a little

307
00:12:26,470 --> 00:12:23,279
bit off so

308
00:12:28,949 --> 00:12:26,480
uh david saunders who was a statistician

309
00:12:32,150 --> 00:12:28,959
who worked on the condon project he was

310
00:12:34,389 --> 00:12:32,160
one of the chief investigators there who

311
00:12:35,990 --> 00:12:34,399
was thrown out because he had found the

312
00:12:39,430 --> 00:12:36,000
trick letter and

313
00:12:42,550 --> 00:12:39,440
and uh the infamous trick letter

314
00:12:45,910 --> 00:12:42,560
and sent it to uh

315
00:12:49,269 --> 00:12:45,920
dr james mcdonald who publicized it but

316
00:12:57,269 --> 00:12:52,790
uh stanton did

317
00:12:59,829 --> 00:12:57,279
that work found the scientists

318
00:13:00,629 --> 00:12:59,839
david saunders said that if there hadn't

319
00:13:03,670 --> 00:13:00,639
been one

320
00:13:06,710 --> 00:13:03,680
slight angle uh problem

321
00:13:09,269 --> 00:13:06,720
that the chance of this happening just

322
00:13:12,389 --> 00:13:09,279
by chance of betty remembering

323
00:13:14,230 --> 00:13:12,399
that and reproducing it as a post

324
00:13:16,870 --> 00:13:14,240
as the result of a post-hypnotic

325
00:13:17,269 --> 00:13:16,880
suggestion would have been a million to

326
00:13:20,710 --> 00:13:17,279
one

327
00:13:24,310 --> 00:13:20,720
but it was reduced to a thousand

328
00:13:25,990 --> 00:13:24,320
to one uh because of that slight angle

329
00:13:29,269 --> 00:13:26,000
difference

330
00:13:31,750 --> 00:13:29,279
amazing just amazing you know i i

331
00:13:32,550 --> 00:13:31,760
say this a lot and only because it's

332
00:13:35,030 --> 00:13:32,560
very true

333
00:13:37,350 --> 00:13:35,040
is that i have a lot of new people that

334
00:13:38,870 --> 00:13:37,360
are new to the ufo world

335
00:13:40,629 --> 00:13:38,880
because and the reason i know that is

336
00:13:41,189 --> 00:13:40,639
i'm getting i'm getting flooded with

337
00:13:43,110 --> 00:13:41,199
emails

338
00:13:44,710 --> 00:13:43,120
people that are are really taking an

339
00:13:46,389 --> 00:13:44,720
interest because

340
00:13:48,069 --> 00:13:46,399
of all the things that have happened for

341
00:13:50,230 --> 00:13:48,079
the last few years

342
00:13:52,150 --> 00:13:50,240
um you know the government coming out

343
00:13:54,550 --> 00:13:52,160
and saying you know this is that

344
00:13:56,389 --> 00:13:54,560
and and we're going to be talking about

345
00:13:57,509 --> 00:13:56,399
that when i have lou elizondo coming up

346
00:13:59,110 --> 00:13:57,519
in a couple weeks

347
00:14:01,990 --> 00:13:59,120
i'm going to be talking about that sort

348
00:14:04,949 --> 00:14:02,000
of thing then but um

349
00:14:06,069 --> 00:14:04,959
what i'm getting at uh uh kathleen is

350
00:14:09,750 --> 00:14:06,079
that

351
00:14:11,350 --> 00:14:09,760
not know

352
00:14:12,870 --> 00:14:11,360
what we're talking about when we talk

353
00:14:15,590 --> 00:14:12,880
about betty and barney hill

354
00:14:16,389 --> 00:14:15,600
and i know there 90 of everyone has

355
00:14:19,269 --> 00:14:16,399
heard it um

356
00:14:19,990 --> 00:14:19,279
a million times or researched it or it's

357
00:14:21,670 --> 00:14:20,000
it's

358
00:14:23,670 --> 00:14:21,680
the you know the one of the biggest

359
00:14:26,949 --> 00:14:23,680
cases as far as

360
00:14:27,750 --> 00:14:26,959
what we call um what was what encounter

361
00:14:32,949 --> 00:14:27,760
is that of the

362
00:14:37,110 --> 00:14:35,910
when you call in a craft and and

363
00:14:39,509 --> 00:14:37,120
communication

364
00:14:42,150 --> 00:14:39,519
occurs let's encounter the fourth kind

365
00:14:44,230 --> 00:14:42,160
okay but anyway this was uh

366
00:14:46,389 --> 00:14:44,240
one of the first ones on record i mean

367
00:14:47,189 --> 00:14:46,399
there was a case back in the 1920s i

368
00:14:49,670 --> 00:14:47,199
guess

369
00:14:51,269 --> 00:14:49,680
where something reportedly happened but

370
00:14:53,350 --> 00:14:51,279
um this is one of the

371
00:14:54,790 --> 00:14:53,360
very early ones and it kind of like

372
00:14:57,670 --> 00:14:54,800
changed everything

373
00:14:57,990 --> 00:14:57,680
in its time so if you can can you tell

374
00:15:01,110 --> 00:14:58,000
what

375
00:15:02,550 --> 00:15:01,120
happened in september of 1961 in kind of

376
00:15:05,670 --> 00:15:02,560
a nutshell

377
00:15:09,110 --> 00:15:05,680
betty and barney were on a vacation

378
00:15:12,310 --> 00:15:09,120
to niagara falls and uh then they took a

379
00:15:15,670 --> 00:15:12,320
leisurely trip from niagara falls uh

380
00:15:17,750 --> 00:15:15,680
through uh canada through ontario

381
00:15:20,710 --> 00:15:17,760
and uh stopped for the night and then

382
00:15:24,550 --> 00:15:20,720
went on to montreal had a wonderful

383
00:15:24,949 --> 00:15:24,560
vacation there and then decided to head

384
00:15:26,949 --> 00:15:24,959
home

385
00:15:29,509 --> 00:15:26,959
through new hampshire because a

386
00:15:33,829 --> 00:15:29,519
hurricane was whirling up the coast

387
00:15:35,590 --> 00:15:33,839
and barney found himself lost and

388
00:15:38,150 --> 00:15:35,600
on the road that would take him to new

389
00:15:40,069 --> 00:15:38,160
hampshire so

390
00:15:41,430 --> 00:15:40,079
on the outskirts of montreal so they

391
00:15:44,949 --> 00:15:41,440
just traveled on

392
00:15:45,749 --> 00:15:44,959
had a great time um during the daylight

393
00:15:49,189 --> 00:15:45,759
hours

394
00:15:52,949 --> 00:15:49,199
and arrived in um new hampshire

395
00:15:53,350 --> 00:15:52,959
at about 9 30 at night they stopped they

396
00:15:56,749 --> 00:15:53,360
had

397
00:15:59,910 --> 00:15:56,759
a little snack and took off at uh

398
00:16:03,670 --> 00:15:59,920
1005 and

399
00:16:07,110 --> 00:16:03,680
headed south and uh in a nutshell

400
00:16:09,990 --> 00:16:07,120
from there a craft came in

401
00:16:11,509 --> 00:16:10,000
closer and closer they got out they

402
00:16:14,870 --> 00:16:11,519
looked at it

403
00:16:17,189 --> 00:16:14,880
and it continued to come in closer

404
00:16:18,150 --> 00:16:17,199
it hovered beside the old man of the

405
00:16:21,269 --> 00:16:18,160
mountain

406
00:16:21,829 --> 00:16:21,279
when they got out to look at it and it

407
00:16:24,949 --> 00:16:21,839
was

408
00:16:27,110 --> 00:16:24,959
then uh at least one and a half

409
00:16:28,150 --> 00:16:27,120
to two times the length of the old man's

410
00:16:31,430 --> 00:16:28,160
profile

411
00:16:34,949 --> 00:16:31,440
which is 48 feet from forehead to chin

412
00:16:37,990 --> 00:16:34,959
they got back into the car uh exited

413
00:16:38,790 --> 00:16:38,000
franconia notch into north lincoln new

414
00:16:41,829 --> 00:16:38,800
hampshire

415
00:16:44,949 --> 00:16:41,839
where all of the cabins and

416
00:16:46,629 --> 00:16:44,959
motels and tourist attractions were this

417
00:16:50,310 --> 00:16:46,639
was the off season

418
00:16:54,870 --> 00:16:50,320
it was september 19 1961

419
00:16:57,030 --> 00:16:54,880
and at about midnight on that night

420
00:16:59,030 --> 00:16:57,040
going into the early morning hours of

421
00:17:01,910 --> 00:16:59,040
september 20th

422
00:17:02,790 --> 00:17:01,920
this craft finally swooped down over

423
00:17:07,270 --> 00:17:02,800
their vehicle

424
00:17:09,110 --> 00:17:07,280
stopped only about 200 feet above them

425
00:17:11,270 --> 00:17:09,120
barney had to pull the car to the middle

426
00:17:12,710 --> 00:17:11,280
of the road so he wouldn't be directly

427
00:17:16,069 --> 00:17:12,720
under the craft

428
00:17:19,510 --> 00:17:16,079
he he got out of the car

429
00:17:22,470 --> 00:17:19,520
and looked at it through binoculars

430
00:17:23,429 --> 00:17:22,480
the craft then shifted to an adjacent

431
00:17:27,029 --> 00:17:23,439
field

432
00:17:30,070 --> 00:17:27,039
he then saw entities dressed in black

433
00:17:33,350 --> 00:17:30,080
shiny uniforms they all but

434
00:17:36,150 --> 00:17:33,360
one turned and walked to a panel

435
00:17:37,110 --> 00:17:36,160
when they did that little red light

436
00:17:39,029 --> 00:17:37,120
started to

437
00:17:40,390 --> 00:17:39,039
come out of the craft and something

438
00:17:42,870 --> 00:17:40,400
started to drop down

439
00:17:43,990 --> 00:17:42,880
out of the bottom from the expression on

440
00:17:46,870 --> 00:17:44,000
the one's face

441
00:17:47,669 --> 00:17:46,880
who was in uh at the window in this

442
00:17:49,990 --> 00:17:47,679
craft

443
00:17:52,150 --> 00:17:50,000
barney believed at that point that there

444
00:17:54,230 --> 00:17:52,160
was a plan to capture him

445
00:17:56,070 --> 00:17:54,240
he went screaming back to the car

446
00:17:56,789 --> 00:17:56,080
telling betty that they had to get out

447
00:17:59,510 --> 00:17:56,799
of there

448
00:18:01,350 --> 00:17:59,520
or they were going to be captured as he

449
00:18:03,350 --> 00:18:01,360
entered the car he saw that the craft

450
00:18:05,830 --> 00:18:03,360
was coming in their direction

451
00:18:07,669 --> 00:18:05,840
within minutes they heard a series of

452
00:18:10,150 --> 00:18:07,679
code-like buzzing sounds

453
00:18:11,510 --> 00:18:10,160
striking the trunk of the car the car

454
00:18:13,590 --> 00:18:11,520
vibrated

455
00:18:14,950 --> 00:18:13,600
electrical tingling sensation passed

456
00:18:16,870 --> 00:18:14,960
through their bodies

457
00:18:19,909 --> 00:18:16,880
as if only a moment had passed they

458
00:18:22,950 --> 00:18:19,919
found themselves 35 miles down the road

459
00:18:25,270 --> 00:18:22,960
with memories of finding themselves

460
00:18:26,390 --> 00:18:25,280
somewhere on a dirt road with tall trees

461
00:18:29,990 --> 00:18:26,400
all around

462
00:18:32,710 --> 00:18:30,000
with of a roadblock and over large

463
00:18:33,990 --> 00:18:32,720
fiery orbs that appeared to be sitting

464
00:18:35,990 --> 00:18:34,000
on the ground

465
00:18:37,029 --> 00:18:36,000
uh they heard another series of buzzing

466
00:18:39,669 --> 00:18:37,039
sounds

467
00:18:41,990 --> 00:18:39,679
and drove on home there was physical

468
00:18:44,310 --> 00:18:42,000
evidence that something

469
00:18:46,230 --> 00:18:44,320
unknown had happened they were later

470
00:18:49,590 --> 00:18:46,240
than they anticipated

471
00:18:52,230 --> 00:18:49,600
by two to three hours and concerned

472
00:18:55,750 --> 00:18:52,240
that the craft had come so close that

473
00:18:59,029 --> 00:18:55,760
they might have been contaminated

474
00:19:01,270 --> 00:18:59,039
wow and so i remember that

475
00:19:03,510 --> 00:19:01,280
well it's one of the cases of that you

476
00:19:07,270 --> 00:19:03,520
hear about missing time it's one of the

477
00:19:10,470 --> 00:19:07,280
early missing time cases really yes

478
00:19:12,870 --> 00:19:10,480
and um they saw the marks on the car

479
00:19:13,510 --> 00:19:12,880
then the next day or or something like

480
00:19:15,669 --> 00:19:13,520
that right

481
00:19:17,190 --> 00:19:15,679
yes the day they arrived home which is

482
00:19:19,669 --> 00:19:17,200
the same day that they were

483
00:19:21,270 --> 00:19:19,679
taken you know they it was the early

484
00:19:25,190 --> 00:19:21,280
morning hours of

485
00:19:28,549 --> 00:19:25,200
uh september 20 1961

486
00:19:32,390 --> 00:19:28,559
they went into the house and

487
00:19:37,990 --> 00:19:36,150
their betty called my mother

488
00:19:39,909 --> 00:19:38,000
my mother called a neighbor of ours who

489
00:19:41,430 --> 00:19:39,919
was a physicist who told betty

490
00:19:43,350 --> 00:19:41,440
that if she had a compass she should

491
00:19:46,230 --> 00:19:43,360
take it out to the trunk of the car

492
00:19:47,669 --> 00:19:46,240
that is when she discovered shiny spots

493
00:19:49,830 --> 00:19:47,679
on the trunk of the car

494
00:19:51,430 --> 00:19:49,840
and the compass world indicating that

495
00:19:54,789 --> 00:19:51,440
there was a magnetic field

496
00:19:57,750 --> 00:19:54,799
there now when someone wants

497
00:19:58,630 --> 00:19:57,760
is asking um so just get this out of the

498
00:20:01,510 --> 00:19:58,640
way real quickly

499
00:20:03,029 --> 00:20:01,520
they wanted to know if you had a contact

500
00:20:04,070 --> 00:20:03,039
email and you do actually on your

501
00:20:08,149 --> 00:20:04,080
website

502
00:20:10,870 --> 00:20:08,159
which is kathleenhyphenmartin.com

503
00:20:11,750 --> 00:20:10,880
is that right that's correct yeah so

504
00:20:15,430 --> 00:20:11,760
someone can get

505
00:20:17,029 --> 00:20:15,440
in touch with you there and um

506
00:20:18,789 --> 00:20:17,039
so they thought they were contaminated

507
00:20:21,590 --> 00:20:18,799
now remember you and i

508
00:20:23,590 --> 00:20:21,600
talking about the dress did the dress

509
00:20:24,470 --> 00:20:23,600
that betty had on at the time did that

510
00:20:26,230 --> 00:20:24,480
ever get

511
00:20:27,590 --> 00:20:26,240
checked out i just can't remember how

512
00:20:29,909 --> 00:20:27,600
that went it did

513
00:20:31,830 --> 00:20:29,919
first uh it was torn from waist to

514
00:20:35,110 --> 00:20:31,840
hemline on the lining the

515
00:20:36,070 --> 00:20:35,120
hem was torn down on one side and the

516
00:20:38,630 --> 00:20:36,080
zipper that ran

517
00:20:39,909 --> 00:20:38,640
up the back of her dress had a two inch

518
00:20:42,470 --> 00:20:39,919
tear in the stitching

519
00:20:43,830 --> 00:20:42,480
and a one inch tear in the thick zipper

520
00:20:45,990 --> 00:20:43,840
fabric

521
00:20:47,190 --> 00:20:46,000
it was in fine shape when she put it on

522
00:20:48,950 --> 00:20:47,200
that morning

523
00:20:50,390 --> 00:20:48,960
when she returned home the following

524
00:20:53,669 --> 00:20:50,400
morning it

525
00:20:57,350 --> 00:20:53,679
uh it was torn it was ruined

526
00:20:59,990 --> 00:20:57,360
um so yes and then when she took it out

527
00:21:02,470 --> 00:21:00,000
of her closet the next time

528
00:21:03,350 --> 00:21:02,480
there was a pink powdery substance on

529
00:21:06,630 --> 00:21:03,360
the dress

530
00:21:09,990 --> 00:21:06,640
it has undergone scientific analysis in

531
00:21:12,230 --> 00:21:10,000
uh probably at about 10 laboratories now

532
00:21:16,789 --> 00:21:12,240
i'll have to count them all up someday

533
00:21:18,310 --> 00:21:16,799
both chemical analysis and dna analysis

534
00:21:20,310 --> 00:21:18,320
when they thought that they were

535
00:21:22,230 --> 00:21:20,320
possibly contaminated

536
00:21:23,669 --> 00:21:22,240
did they take any actions like go to the

537
00:21:24,470 --> 00:21:23,679
hospital and get checked out or anything

538
00:21:28,230 --> 00:21:24,480
like that

539
00:21:30,149 --> 00:21:28,240
they took long showers and

540
00:21:32,630 --> 00:21:30,159
that's what they did the scientists

541
00:21:36,630 --> 00:21:32,640
didn't tell them to do anything else

542
00:21:38,630 --> 00:21:36,640
physicists and i remember the last time

543
00:21:39,830 --> 00:21:38,640
you were on the show i believe the last

544
00:21:42,630 --> 00:21:39,840
time you were on

545
00:21:43,350 --> 00:21:42,640
uh lee spiegel called in and talked

546
00:21:46,950 --> 00:21:43,360
about

547
00:21:49,430 --> 00:21:46,960
pease air force base um a report there

548
00:21:50,789 --> 00:21:49,440
that was that's that was a new angle i

549
00:21:54,070 --> 00:21:50,799
had never heard of

550
00:21:56,950 --> 00:21:54,080
before yeah there was a radar report at

551
00:21:58,630 --> 00:21:56,960
pease air force base at 2 14 a.m and

552
00:22:02,549 --> 00:21:58,640
then the north concord

553
00:22:03,590 --> 00:22:02,559
vermont uh radar station which was 17

554
00:22:07,110 --> 00:22:03,600
miles

555
00:22:10,830 --> 00:22:07,120
from um where they were in new hampshire

556
00:22:13,190 --> 00:22:10,840
uh also earlier in the evening had a

557
00:22:16,149 --> 00:22:13,200
large

558
00:22:17,590 --> 00:22:16,159
some kind of craft that was flying

559
00:22:20,390 --> 00:22:17,600
erratically against

560
00:22:22,390 --> 00:22:20,400
the wind and the air force rode off as a

561
00:22:25,990 --> 00:22:22,400
weather balloon

562
00:22:28,070 --> 00:22:26,000
again yes against the wind

563
00:22:29,110 --> 00:22:28,080
i i've mentioned this on my show before

564
00:22:42,470 --> 00:22:29,120
i

565
00:22:44,230 --> 00:22:42,480
on our house was uh a loan house on a

566
00:22:46,470 --> 00:22:44,240
hill called winter hill

567
00:22:47,590 --> 00:22:46,480
and so we were up there and i could look

568
00:22:49,510 --> 00:22:47,600
across and

569
00:22:51,350 --> 00:22:49,520
not quite see the runway but i could see

570
00:22:52,549 --> 00:22:51,360
when they're touching down on the runway

571
00:22:54,149 --> 00:22:52,559
and taking off

572
00:22:56,149 --> 00:22:54,159
but i do remember seeing weather

573
00:22:57,750 --> 00:22:56,159
balloons because

574
00:22:59,270 --> 00:22:57,760
my sister and i would sit on the lawn

575
00:23:02,149 --> 00:22:59,280
with a binoculars and

576
00:23:04,149 --> 00:23:02,159
see these odd things like just they they

577
00:23:05,990 --> 00:23:04,159
didn't take off but they tethered them

578
00:23:07,270 --> 00:23:06,000
for some reason they were just sitting

579
00:23:09,990 --> 00:23:07,280
there we thought they were

580
00:23:11,270 --> 00:23:10,000
ufos i remember we were thinking that's

581
00:23:14,950 --> 00:23:11,280
what they were but they weren't

582
00:23:18,630 --> 00:23:14,960
moving maybe they were ufos i don't know

583
00:23:22,149 --> 00:23:18,640
but uh so this happened

584
00:23:23,110 --> 00:23:22,159
and when did it actually become public

585
00:23:24,710 --> 00:23:23,120
because i remember

586
00:23:27,750 --> 00:23:24,720
reading somewhere where betty and barney

587
00:23:28,630 --> 00:23:27,760
spoke in like methuen mass or someplace

588
00:23:31,909 --> 00:23:28,640
like that at some

589
00:23:33,270 --> 00:23:31,919
conference before it actually snowballed

590
00:23:36,470 --> 00:23:33,280
or was it just after that

591
00:23:39,909 --> 00:23:36,480
yeah it wasn't a conference they

592
00:23:41,029 --> 00:23:39,919
were attempting to discover more

593
00:23:43,669 --> 00:23:41,039
information

594
00:23:46,230 --> 00:23:43,679
especially betty she was uh she wanted

595
00:23:47,750 --> 00:23:46,240
to learn all that she could about ufos

596
00:23:51,750 --> 00:23:47,760
after this occurred

597
00:23:55,029 --> 00:23:51,760
and walter webb uh who was an astronomer

598
00:23:58,470 --> 00:23:55,039
at the hayden planetarium in boston

599
00:24:01,669 --> 00:23:58,480
uh was also a nycap member and he

600
00:24:07,590 --> 00:24:01,679
is the one who investigated their case

601
00:24:10,630 --> 00:24:07,600
and so they uh betty and barney in 1963

602
00:24:13,750 --> 00:24:10,640
went to a nycap meeting

603
00:24:17,510 --> 00:24:13,760
uh the tri tr i think it was

604
00:24:21,590 --> 00:24:17,520
no two-state study group ufo study group

605
00:24:23,350 --> 00:24:21,600
and betty and barney ended up at the end

606
00:24:26,310 --> 00:24:23,360
of the meeting

607
00:24:27,870 --> 00:24:26,320
talking about their sighting but this

608
00:24:31,110 --> 00:24:27,880
was supposed to remain

609
00:24:33,909 --> 00:24:31,120
confidential but i have the letter

610
00:24:35,909 --> 00:24:33,919
from the newspaper reporter who wrote to

611
00:24:39,350 --> 00:24:35,919
betty and barney and said

612
00:24:40,149 --> 00:24:39,360
that their that betty's friend had been

613
00:24:43,750 --> 00:24:40,159
talking

614
00:24:46,390 --> 00:24:43,760
with him and if they would talk with him

615
00:24:47,350 --> 00:24:46,400
uh even though he was a newspaper

616
00:24:50,549 --> 00:24:47,360
reporter

617
00:24:51,830 --> 00:24:50,559
he would never commercialize their story

618
00:24:55,110 --> 00:24:51,840
and betty and barney said

619
00:24:58,149 --> 00:24:55,120
absolutely not uh in fact he went

620
00:24:59,830 --> 00:24:58,159
up to their house one night and sat on

621
00:25:03,269 --> 00:24:59,840
their steps and they

622
00:25:05,750 --> 00:25:03,279
escaped out the back door and went to my

623
00:25:07,750 --> 00:25:05,760
grandparents house i grew up across the

624
00:25:10,950 --> 00:25:07,760
street from my grandparents

625
00:25:14,149 --> 00:25:10,960
and they sat and we talked and and they

626
00:25:17,669 --> 00:25:14,159
waited until they thought he had finally

627
00:25:20,950 --> 00:25:17,679
left and and drove back to portsmouth

628
00:25:23,590 --> 00:25:20,960
uh so he

629
00:25:25,269 --> 00:25:23,600
ended up talking to everyone else except

630
00:25:27,430 --> 00:25:25,279
for betty and barney it seems

631
00:25:29,830 --> 00:25:27,440
they didn't he didn't talk to dr simon

632
00:25:33,190 --> 00:25:29,840
but he talked to the air force

633
00:25:36,149 --> 00:25:33,200
he found 12 to 14 people

634
00:25:37,669 --> 00:25:36,159
i have recently discovered in files

635
00:25:41,029 --> 00:25:37,679
stanton gave me

636
00:25:42,630 --> 00:25:41,039
before he passed that he discovered 12

637
00:25:46,230 --> 00:25:42,640
to 14 people

638
00:25:48,630 --> 00:25:46,240
who were in that area that night

639
00:25:51,430 --> 00:25:48,640
and observed the same craft that betty

640
00:25:54,710 --> 00:25:51,440
and barney observed and he knew that

641
00:25:55,669 --> 00:25:54,720
because he drew lines from where betty

642
00:25:58,230 --> 00:25:55,679
and barney were

643
00:25:59,510 --> 00:25:58,240
where the craft was and where those

644
00:26:02,789 --> 00:25:59,520
individuals were

645
00:26:05,669 --> 00:26:02,799
and those lines intersected

646
00:26:06,390 --> 00:26:05,679
now um i remember you know you hear all

647
00:26:09,269 --> 00:26:06,400
sides of

648
00:26:11,190 --> 00:26:09,279
of this and and what people have said

649
00:26:13,430 --> 00:26:11,200
over the years

650
00:26:15,430 --> 00:26:13,440
and um one of the things that comes up

651
00:26:17,990 --> 00:26:15,440
now and then is people talk about

652
00:26:19,350 --> 00:26:18,000
the episode called the bolero shield on

653
00:26:22,630 --> 00:26:19,360
the outer limits

654
00:26:26,549 --> 00:26:22,640
and that was uh that had come out

655
00:26:30,549 --> 00:26:26,559
and that the um the alien figures

656
00:26:32,710 --> 00:26:30,559
that barney described looked similar to

657
00:26:33,669 --> 00:26:32,720
um what they were in the outer limits

658
00:26:35,669 --> 00:26:33,679
episode

659
00:26:37,029 --> 00:26:35,679
and and what do you say to that when you

660
00:26:39,029 --> 00:26:37,039
hear about that

661
00:26:40,230 --> 00:26:39,039
when people talk about that what i say

662
00:26:44,149 --> 00:26:40,240
to that to that

663
00:26:45,830 --> 00:26:44,159
is that on september 26 1961

664
00:26:47,430 --> 00:26:45,840
betty and barney sat down and wrote a

665
00:26:50,789 --> 00:26:47,440
letter to nycap

666
00:26:53,510 --> 00:26:50,799
and described those entities as uh

667
00:26:55,110 --> 00:26:53,520
wearing black shiny uniforms and were so

668
00:26:56,710 --> 00:26:55,120
startling to barney

669
00:26:58,230 --> 00:26:56,720
that he remembered their facial

670
00:27:01,510 --> 00:26:58,240
expressions but not

671
00:27:03,190 --> 00:27:01,520
the features on their faces he told

672
00:27:05,269 --> 00:27:03,200
walter webb

673
00:27:06,390 --> 00:27:05,279
during his investigation in early

674
00:27:09,510 --> 00:27:06,400
october

675
00:27:12,390 --> 00:27:09,520
that they were none

676
00:27:13,990 --> 00:27:12,400
uh they were somehow not human that's a

677
00:27:17,990 --> 00:27:14,000
quote somehow not

678
00:27:21,510 --> 00:27:18,000
human uh superior type of entities

679
00:27:25,029 --> 00:27:21,520
uh not from this earth uh in terms of

680
00:27:27,750 --> 00:27:25,039
the bolero shield uh

681
00:27:28,789 --> 00:27:27,760
betty and barney didn't watch that first

682
00:27:32,310 --> 00:27:28,799
of all

683
00:27:35,590 --> 00:27:32,320
carl flock who worked for the cia

684
00:27:39,830 --> 00:27:35,600
during his lifetime he was the uh debt

685
00:27:43,430 --> 00:27:39,840
former deputy assistant uh

686
00:27:46,470 --> 00:27:43,440
of uh a defense

687
00:27:49,990 --> 00:27:46,480
and did a

688
00:27:53,269 --> 00:27:50,000
thorough investigation of

689
00:27:56,870 --> 00:27:53,279
betty and barney's story and uh

690
00:27:59,190 --> 00:27:56,880
he addressed that he said that

691
00:28:00,870 --> 00:27:59,200
they were not science fiction fans there

692
00:28:04,149 --> 00:28:00,880
was not a science fiction

693
00:28:06,310 --> 00:28:04,159
book in betty's house despite what the

694
00:28:09,990 --> 00:28:06,320
disinformants said

695
00:28:12,389 --> 00:28:10,000
and so in terms of

696
00:28:14,470 --> 00:28:12,399
barney seeing that i have actually

697
00:28:16,950 --> 00:28:14,480
written a paper somewhere

698
00:28:18,549 --> 00:28:16,960
on the difference between the entities

699
00:28:20,710 --> 00:28:18,559
and the bolero shield

700
00:28:22,470 --> 00:28:20,720
and what barney and betty remembered

701
00:28:25,590 --> 00:28:22,480
under hypnosis

702
00:28:27,909 --> 00:28:25,600
in the bolero shield uh that was

703
00:28:29,990 --> 00:28:27,919
viewed in black and white and those

704
00:28:33,029 --> 00:28:30,000
masks were paper mache

705
00:28:35,669 --> 00:28:33,039
what you see uh is a new

706
00:28:38,630 --> 00:28:35,679
modern mask that's made to look a lot

707
00:28:42,710 --> 00:28:38,640
like what betty and barney described

708
00:28:46,549 --> 00:28:42,720
so uh that's deceptive in my mind

709
00:28:49,269 --> 00:28:46,559
up there also

710
00:28:49,990 --> 00:28:49,279
the eyes were that betty and barney saw

711
00:28:52,789 --> 00:28:50,000
were different

712
00:28:54,789 --> 00:28:52,799
than the bolero shield eyes uh the

713
00:28:57,430 --> 00:28:54,799
person in the bolero shield i think had

714
00:29:01,669 --> 00:28:57,440
a wide thing in a regular human

715
00:29:02,310 --> 00:29:01,679
mouth and chin that isn't what betty and

716
00:29:06,870 --> 00:29:02,320
barney

717
00:29:10,070 --> 00:29:06,880
described the non-human entities

718
00:29:13,110 --> 00:29:10,080
spoke telepathically the the

719
00:29:13,750 --> 00:29:13,120
bolero shield person was speaking in

720
00:29:17,190 --> 00:29:13,760
english

721
00:29:17,669 --> 00:29:17,200
the bolero shield person was wearing a

722
00:29:21,669 --> 00:29:17,679
light

723
00:29:23,750 --> 00:29:21,679
turtleneck uh betty and barney saw

724
00:29:24,789 --> 00:29:23,760
non-humans dressed in black shiny

725
00:29:27,350 --> 00:29:24,799
uniforms

726
00:29:29,909 --> 00:29:27,360
the bolero shield individual had a

727
00:29:31,269 --> 00:29:29,919
regular human body that's not what betty

728
00:29:33,669 --> 00:29:31,279
and barney saw

729
00:29:35,430 --> 00:29:33,679
so there are so many differences i don't

730
00:29:38,830 --> 00:29:35,440
know how anyone can

731
00:29:42,310 --> 00:29:38,840
uh say i can dismiss this

732
00:29:45,029 --> 00:29:42,320
as uh some television show that barney

733
00:29:48,310 --> 00:29:45,039
watched it's uh absolutely absurd

734
00:29:50,149 --> 00:29:48,320
when you really look at it yeah

735
00:29:52,230 --> 00:29:50,159
so it's always good to talk about what

736
00:29:54,230 --> 00:29:52,240
you hear out there you know when you

737
00:29:55,269 --> 00:29:54,240
you know to clear things up and that

738
00:29:57,190 --> 00:29:55,279
that's my my

739
00:29:59,350 --> 00:29:57,200
meaning for that i just want to give a

740
00:30:02,230 --> 00:29:59,360
little shout out to mark stanley

741
00:30:04,310 --> 00:30:02,240
in the uh chat room um he has written

742
00:30:07,350 --> 00:30:04,320
some beautiful music of

743
00:30:08,149 --> 00:30:07,360
many many beautiful uh things over the

744
00:30:11,350 --> 00:30:08,159
years

745
00:30:11,830 --> 00:30:11,360
but uh we do play uh i do play his music

746
00:30:14,070 --> 00:30:11,840
on my

747
00:30:15,269 --> 00:30:14,080
antiques show and have played it on this

748
00:30:18,230 --> 00:30:15,279
show before

749
00:30:18,549 --> 00:30:18,240
um so hello mark out in uh california uh

750
00:30:21,190 --> 00:30:18,559
but

751
00:30:22,950 --> 00:30:21,200
uh so there is a question that came in

752
00:30:25,269 --> 00:30:22,960
here and i wanted to put it up

753
00:30:27,190 --> 00:30:25,279
in front of you so you can read it from

754
00:30:28,870 --> 00:30:27,200
anonymous rex did betty or barney ever

755
00:30:31,350 --> 00:30:28,880
talk about repeating themes

756
00:30:33,190 --> 00:30:31,360
in their dreams or remember more through

757
00:30:34,230 --> 00:30:33,200
their dreams before or after their

758
00:30:36,710 --> 00:30:34,240
contact

759
00:30:39,190 --> 00:30:36,720
okay the idea that both betty and barney

760
00:30:42,789 --> 00:30:39,200
were having dreams as faults

761
00:30:44,549 --> 00:30:42,799
that's another uh more information put

762
00:30:47,669 --> 00:30:44,559
out by disinformants who

763
00:30:51,029 --> 00:30:47,679
were attempting to refute the case uh

764
00:30:53,510 --> 00:30:51,039
betty had five dreams and they began

765
00:30:55,269 --> 00:30:53,520
ten nights after the experience and they

766
00:30:58,950 --> 00:30:55,279
lasted for five nights

767
00:31:01,669 --> 00:30:58,960
she had these dreams uh in the morning

768
00:31:03,830 --> 00:31:01,679
just before she awakened barney was

769
00:31:05,110 --> 00:31:03,840
working nights at that time so he wasn't

770
00:31:08,470 --> 00:31:05,120
at home

771
00:31:12,070 --> 00:31:08,480
when she had these dreams they were

772
00:31:13,669 --> 00:31:12,080
i have recently learned had kind of a

773
00:31:18,870 --> 00:31:13,679
hypnopomic

774
00:31:21,909 --> 00:31:18,880
uh sense like a light state of hypnosis

775
00:31:25,430 --> 00:31:21,919
and in that type of dream

776
00:31:28,789 --> 00:31:25,440
just before you wake up it can include

777
00:31:31,509 --> 00:31:28,799
uh true memories real memories

778
00:31:33,590 --> 00:31:31,519
but also fantasy can be added in order

779
00:31:37,029 --> 00:31:33,600
to attempt to work through

780
00:31:37,669 --> 00:31:37,039
uh problems or anxiety that you might be

781
00:31:41,110 --> 00:31:37,679
having

782
00:31:43,350 --> 00:31:41,120
barney did not have any of these dreams

783
00:31:44,470 --> 00:31:43,360
his first dream came when he was under

784
00:31:47,430 --> 00:31:44,480
hypnosis

785
00:31:48,149 --> 00:31:47,440
with dr simon and i think that probably

786
00:31:51,750 --> 00:31:48,159
the reason

787
00:31:55,029 --> 00:31:51,760
that uh betty was able to

788
00:31:58,389 --> 00:31:55,039
tolerate this more emotionally was

789
00:31:59,110 --> 00:31:58,399
um because she had these dreams barney

790
00:32:02,149 --> 00:31:59,120
didn't

791
00:32:08,470 --> 00:32:05,269
troubled him uh and as time went on

792
00:32:09,430 --> 00:32:08,480
it troubled him you to an even greater

793
00:32:11,350 --> 00:32:09,440
degree

794
00:32:13,669 --> 00:32:11,360
well barney was the one who had the

795
00:32:13,990 --> 00:32:13,679
conscious continuous recall of observing

796
00:32:17,590 --> 00:32:14,000
those

797
00:32:20,789 --> 00:32:17,600
non-humans on the craft and feeling that

798
00:32:23,669 --> 00:32:20,799
their plan for him was to capture him

799
00:32:24,470 --> 00:32:23,679
betty didn't see those entities on the

800
00:32:26,389 --> 00:32:24,480
craft

801
00:32:28,389 --> 00:32:26,399
she was sitting in the car in the

802
00:32:29,590 --> 00:32:28,399
passenger seat that he had parked in the

803
00:32:32,470 --> 00:32:29,600
middle of the road

804
00:32:34,630 --> 00:32:32,480
she was looking for traffic on the

805
00:32:35,669 --> 00:32:34,640
highway because she was going to have to

806
00:32:38,230 --> 00:32:35,679
pull the car

807
00:32:39,029 --> 00:32:38,240
to the side of the road and the internal

808
00:32:42,149 --> 00:32:39,039
light was on

809
00:32:42,789 --> 00:32:42,159
so uh you know she just didn't see what

810
00:32:45,750 --> 00:32:42,799
was going

811
00:32:47,750 --> 00:32:45,760
on barney did and he was he developed

812
00:32:50,630 --> 00:32:47,760
post-traumatic stress disorder

813
00:32:51,830 --> 00:32:50,640
what they called conversion hysteria uh

814
00:32:55,350 --> 00:32:51,840
where he developed

815
00:32:56,549 --> 00:32:55,360
uh bleeding ulcers uh had to take time

816
00:32:59,110 --> 00:32:56,559
off from

817
00:33:00,549 --> 00:32:59,120
work he was in the hospital with the

818
00:33:04,470 --> 00:33:00,559
bleeding ulcers

819
00:33:05,509 --> 00:33:04,480
wow yes and and high blood pressure he

820
00:33:08,630 --> 00:33:05,519
was having

821
00:33:13,350 --> 00:33:08,640
uh some serious difficulties over

822
00:33:15,590 --> 00:33:13,360
uh this experience that he had and

823
00:33:17,509 --> 00:33:15,600
also the fact that his shoes were so

824
00:33:20,149 --> 00:33:17,519
deeply scraped that he had to purchase

825
00:33:21,590 --> 00:33:20,159
new shoes there was there was evidence

826
00:33:24,710 --> 00:33:21,600
that he couldn't explain

827
00:33:27,110 --> 00:33:24,720
and it bothered him terribly and

828
00:33:29,830 --> 00:33:27,120
that is the reason that he was referred

829
00:33:32,470 --> 00:33:29,840
to dr benjamin simon

830
00:33:33,509 --> 00:33:32,480
i see um over on facebook we have a

831
00:33:36,070 --> 00:33:33,519
question

832
00:33:38,470 --> 00:33:36,080
uh did or were they aware of incidents

833
00:33:38,870 --> 00:33:38,480
before this one or after and i do have

834
00:33:40,950 --> 00:33:38,880
to

835
00:33:42,230 --> 00:33:40,960
my little chime in on that is this is

836
00:33:44,389 --> 00:33:42,240
actually

837
00:33:45,509 --> 00:33:44,399
really kind of the first known one of of

838
00:33:47,430 --> 00:33:45,519
its kind

839
00:33:48,630 --> 00:33:47,440
um again i mentioned earlier in the 20

840
00:33:49,350 --> 00:33:48,640
something happened but that wasn't

841
00:33:52,950 --> 00:33:49,360
really

842
00:33:54,789 --> 00:33:52,960
one but

843
00:33:56,389 --> 00:33:54,799
what about after though i mean did they

844
00:33:59,110 --> 00:33:56,399
pay attention what was going on

845
00:34:00,630 --> 00:33:59,120
after that i mean the first case that

846
00:34:02,549 --> 00:34:00,640
was similar to hers have

847
00:34:04,389 --> 00:34:02,559
theirs happened many many years after

848
00:34:07,110 --> 00:34:04,399
right yes um

849
00:34:08,550 --> 00:34:07,120
the the first case that happened after

850
00:34:11,909 --> 00:34:08,560
theirs that they

851
00:34:13,270 --> 00:34:11,919
were aware of were uh that was the

852
00:34:17,909 --> 00:34:13,280
charlie hixson

853
00:34:21,829 --> 00:34:17,919
and calvin parker case in 1973.

854
00:34:22,230 --> 00:34:21,839
then uh travis walton uh came up after

855
00:34:24,149 --> 00:34:22,240
that

856
00:34:26,629 --> 00:34:24,159
and then there were three women in

857
00:34:27,669 --> 00:34:26,639
kentucky barney didn't live for any of

858
00:34:31,190 --> 00:34:27,679
this barney

859
00:34:33,829 --> 00:34:31,200
died in 1969. ah

860
00:34:35,510 --> 00:34:33,839
by the way uh calvin parker was uh of

861
00:34:37,990 --> 00:34:35,520
that incident was on recently

862
00:34:39,990 --> 00:34:38,000
and i've been pretty uh good friends

863
00:34:41,589 --> 00:34:40,000
with him over the last few years and

864
00:34:43,829 --> 00:34:41,599
in touch with him all the time and and

865
00:34:46,550 --> 00:34:43,839
um i just want to say that he

866
00:34:47,030 --> 00:34:46,560
he's not doing too well right now and so

867
00:34:52,389 --> 00:34:47,040
uh

868
00:34:55,510 --> 00:34:52,399
thoughts to him out there

869
00:34:58,870 --> 00:34:55,520
i i worked with calvin under hypnosis

870
00:35:01,589 --> 00:34:58,880
oh you did yes i did that was uh

871
00:35:03,430 --> 00:35:01,599
interesting to have him relive two

872
00:35:05,430 --> 00:35:03,440
experiences that he had

873
00:35:06,950 --> 00:35:05,440
with crap i know you probably can't

874
00:35:08,950 --> 00:35:06,960
really talk about that but

875
00:35:10,230 --> 00:35:08,960
uh but that is i don't know if you can

876
00:35:13,829 --> 00:35:10,240
or not i don't know how that

877
00:35:16,870 --> 00:35:13,839
that works i no one told me that i can't

878
00:35:20,150 --> 00:35:16,880
yeah it was uh

879
00:35:23,589 --> 00:35:20,160
having him relive it uh was

880
00:35:27,430 --> 00:35:23,599
very interesting uh what i got out of

881
00:35:31,510 --> 00:35:27,440
all of this is that he was being

882
00:35:32,069 --> 00:35:31,520
warned about the the danger of nuclear

883
00:35:35,430 --> 00:35:32,079
weapons

884
00:35:38,310 --> 00:35:35,440
just like every other experiencer uh

885
00:35:40,470 --> 00:35:38,320
these non-human entities wanted him to

886
00:35:43,589 --> 00:35:40,480
carry that message to the public

887
00:35:47,190 --> 00:35:43,599
on the last abduction that he had

888
00:35:50,630 --> 00:35:47,200
he uh she was very very

889
00:35:53,349 --> 00:35:50,640
upset with him she treated him very very

890
00:35:55,349 --> 00:35:53,359
roughly and and and in return he tried

891
00:35:57,430 --> 00:35:55,359
to kill her

892
00:35:59,270 --> 00:35:57,440
put his hands around her neck and beat

893
00:36:02,790 --> 00:35:59,280
her head against the wall

894
00:36:06,150 --> 00:36:02,800
until fluid ran out of her ears

895
00:36:08,710 --> 00:36:06,160
and this story is very different the the

896
00:36:09,430 --> 00:36:08,720
entities are very different from any of

897
00:36:12,230 --> 00:36:09,440
the others

898
00:36:13,589 --> 00:36:12,240
that i have cases i've ever worked on

899
00:36:17,030 --> 00:36:13,599
and i've worked on a lot

900
00:36:20,630 --> 00:36:17,040
over the past 30 years and

901
00:36:21,030 --> 00:36:20,640
that woman let out a sound that calvin

902
00:36:24,630 --> 00:36:21,040
said

903
00:36:28,069 --> 00:36:24,640
sounded like an alligator mating call

904
00:36:31,349 --> 00:36:28,079
and it activated this little robot

905
00:36:32,550 --> 00:36:31,359
who uh were the ones who intercepted

906
00:36:35,430 --> 00:36:32,560
calvin

907
00:36:37,670 --> 00:36:35,440
parker and charlie hixson and took them

908
00:36:41,109 --> 00:36:37,680
onto the craft

909
00:36:44,390 --> 00:36:41,119
it was it was really a horrific

910
00:36:44,790 --> 00:36:44,400
experience that calvin had uh he wanted

911
00:36:48,310 --> 00:36:44,800
to

912
00:36:50,870 --> 00:36:48,320
take that woman and

913
00:36:53,349 --> 00:36:50,880
jump off the craft with her if he could

914
00:36:56,069 --> 00:36:53,359
get out of there but he couldn't

915
00:36:56,870 --> 00:36:56,079
um you know that he didn't care if he

916
00:37:00,630 --> 00:36:56,880
died that

917
00:37:01,190 --> 00:37:00,640
he wanted her dead is basically what it

918
00:37:04,550 --> 00:37:01,200
was

919
00:37:08,790 --> 00:37:04,560
so she just she treated him terribly

920
00:37:11,750 --> 00:37:08,800
but it was all about nuclear war

921
00:37:13,990 --> 00:37:11,760
and uh you know calvin's father worked

922
00:37:17,430 --> 00:37:14,000
in the nuclear industry

923
00:37:18,069 --> 00:37:17,440
and i know that calvin uh had a drilling

924
00:37:20,870 --> 00:37:18,079
business

925
00:37:22,150 --> 00:37:20,880
and i think he did like airport

926
00:37:25,109 --> 00:37:22,160
infrastructure under

927
00:37:27,109 --> 00:37:25,119
under runways yes yeah so i don't know

928
00:37:30,150 --> 00:37:27,119
he was involved in nuclear

929
00:37:33,829 --> 00:37:30,160
uh weapons or

930
00:37:36,790 --> 00:37:33,839
digging for the holes for them at least

931
00:37:37,430 --> 00:37:36,800
but uh you know that was her major

932
00:37:40,390 --> 00:37:37,440
message

933
00:37:42,230 --> 00:37:40,400
which he had and he had not complied he

934
00:37:43,030 --> 00:37:42,240
didn't even remember it how could he

935
00:37:46,310 --> 00:37:43,040
reply

936
00:37:47,190 --> 00:37:46,320
or comply with her wishes but you know

937
00:37:49,670 --> 00:37:47,200
all the times

938
00:37:51,430 --> 00:37:49,680
the many many times he and i have talked

939
00:37:52,150 --> 00:37:51,440
not not just on the show but on the

940
00:37:54,550 --> 00:37:52,160
phone or

941
00:37:55,349 --> 00:37:54,560
whatever i've never heard him mention

942
00:37:59,030 --> 00:37:55,359
any of this

943
00:38:02,310 --> 00:37:59,040
this is really quite amazing

944
00:38:05,589 --> 00:38:02,320
he's such a kind gentle person

945
00:38:07,910 --> 00:38:05,599
he's wonderful yeah yes and um but he

946
00:38:10,870 --> 00:38:07,920
did the only thing he ever said is that

947
00:38:11,510 --> 00:38:10,880
she put the like long fingers down his

948
00:38:14,950 --> 00:38:11,520
throat

949
00:38:17,270 --> 00:38:14,960
or something like that causing

950
00:38:18,069 --> 00:38:17,280
injury and causing him to bleed and

951
00:38:21,589 --> 00:38:18,079
develop

952
00:38:25,349 --> 00:38:21,599
he did say that yeah yes yeah

953
00:38:28,150 --> 00:38:25,359
wow amazing well i want to also um

954
00:38:29,349 --> 00:38:28,160
ask you you mentioned that you started

955
00:38:33,430 --> 00:38:29,359
looking at betty

956
00:38:37,190 --> 00:38:33,440
and barney's case in 1990

957
00:38:41,109 --> 00:38:37,200
so between 1961 and 1990

958
00:38:44,470 --> 00:38:41,119
were you was it a family discussion on

959
00:38:45,990 --> 00:38:44,480
did you talk about the you know what

960
00:38:48,710 --> 00:38:46,000
happened to betty and barney a lot

961
00:38:50,390 --> 00:38:48,720
was that a part of topic topics that

962
00:38:53,510 --> 00:38:50,400
your family would talk about

963
00:38:57,270 --> 00:38:53,520
yes uh especially when uh dr

964
00:39:00,390 --> 00:38:57,280
simon uh allowed them to remember

965
00:39:02,790 --> 00:39:00,400
what they had stated under hypnosis he

966
00:39:07,109 --> 00:39:02,800
had hypnotized them separately

967
00:39:09,109 --> 00:39:07,119
and reinstated amnesia

968
00:39:11,030 --> 00:39:09,119
so they couldn't communicate with one

969
00:39:12,790 --> 00:39:11,040
another what about what they

970
00:39:14,069 --> 00:39:12,800
recalled because they couldn't recall

971
00:39:16,390 --> 00:39:14,079
what they'd said

972
00:39:17,829 --> 00:39:16,400
and that went on for four months and

973
00:39:21,829 --> 00:39:17,839
then for the last

974
00:39:25,670 --> 00:39:21,839
two months he uh put them in the same

975
00:39:28,550 --> 00:39:25,680
room together with him and they listened

976
00:39:30,069 --> 00:39:28,560
to each other's tapes they listened

977
00:39:33,430 --> 00:39:30,079
together to what they

978
00:39:35,750 --> 00:39:33,440
said and then uh kind of

979
00:39:36,470 --> 00:39:35,760
integrated it into their consciousness

980
00:39:39,829 --> 00:39:36,480
and work

981
00:39:43,030 --> 00:39:39,839
through the emotional trauma that

982
00:39:44,710 --> 00:39:43,040
was related to that event

983
00:39:47,510 --> 00:39:44,720
now i know you've said this before and

984
00:39:50,790 --> 00:39:47,520
i've asked you this question in the past

985
00:39:52,870 --> 00:39:50,800
but how did the story first get out

986
00:39:54,550 --> 00:39:52,880
about what happened i mean they they did

987
00:39:56,870 --> 00:39:54,560
not want it to get out

988
00:39:57,910 --> 00:39:56,880
right well let me finish the okay go

989
00:40:00,710 --> 00:39:57,920
ahead sure

990
00:40:02,310 --> 00:40:00,720
say about the question did uh did we

991
00:40:04,550 --> 00:40:02,320
talk about it as a family

992
00:40:05,349 --> 00:40:04,560
when they were coming home from dr

993
00:40:07,750 --> 00:40:05,359
simon's

994
00:40:09,910 --> 00:40:07,760
office uh they stopped at my

995
00:40:11,829 --> 00:40:09,920
grandparents house i grew up across the

996
00:40:15,430 --> 00:40:11,839
street from my grandparents so

997
00:40:19,030 --> 00:40:15,440
we went over and we we found out

998
00:40:22,829 --> 00:40:19,040
then what they remembered under hypnosis

999
00:40:26,150 --> 00:40:22,839
uh and then how did the story get out

1000
00:40:29,430 --> 00:40:26,160
um betty and barney

1001
00:40:33,829 --> 00:40:29,440
wanted it to remain confidential

1002
00:40:36,790 --> 00:40:33,839
and a friend of betty's

1003
00:40:38,630 --> 00:40:36,800
a woman who was a ufo investigator she

1004
00:40:40,309 --> 00:40:38,640
didn't know this woman before this

1005
00:40:44,230 --> 00:40:40,319
happened she met her

1006
00:40:44,790 --> 00:40:44,240
probably in 1960 though probably two or

1007
00:40:48,630 --> 00:40:44,800
three

1008
00:40:51,829 --> 00:40:48,640
something like that and

1009
00:40:52,870 --> 00:40:51,839
the woman lived near a newspaper

1010
00:40:54,710 --> 00:40:52,880
reporter

1011
00:40:56,470 --> 00:40:54,720
named john latrell he wrote for the

1012
00:40:59,910 --> 00:40:56,480
boston traveler

1013
00:41:03,430 --> 00:40:59,920
i have um

1014
00:41:06,870 --> 00:41:03,440
betty a letter that john letrell wrote

1015
00:41:10,390 --> 00:41:06,880
to uh betty and barney naming her

1016
00:41:13,510 --> 00:41:10,400
so i know that for a fact and he said

1017
00:41:16,470 --> 00:41:13,520
uh that he would like to speak with them

1018
00:41:17,990 --> 00:41:16,480
and if they would meet with him that

1019
00:41:21,829 --> 00:41:18,000
they

1020
00:41:23,670 --> 00:41:21,839
uh would uh he would never write about

1021
00:41:24,230 --> 00:41:23,680
it it would be just be for his own

1022
00:41:27,190 --> 00:41:24,240
personal

1023
00:41:29,270 --> 00:41:27,200
information they refused they said no we

1024
00:41:32,309 --> 00:41:29,280
we will not speak with you

1025
00:41:34,790 --> 00:41:32,319
uh he went uh

1026
00:41:37,670 --> 00:41:34,800
to their house they escaped they went to

1027
00:41:41,109 --> 00:41:37,680
my grandparents house again

1028
00:41:45,829 --> 00:41:41,119
they finally went back home and

1029
00:41:51,030 --> 00:41:48,870
investigating it himself found those

1030
00:41:54,230 --> 00:41:51,040
witnesses that i spoke about

1031
00:41:57,190 --> 00:41:54,240
spoke to the air force and

1032
00:42:00,829 --> 00:41:57,200
then wrote about it for five days in

1033
00:42:05,109 --> 00:42:02,870
1965.

1034
00:42:06,470 --> 00:42:05,119
more it was devastating to betty and

1035
00:42:09,670 --> 00:42:06,480
barney

1036
00:42:11,270 --> 00:42:09,680
it was completely devastating especially

1037
00:42:14,309 --> 00:42:11,280
to barney who

1038
00:42:17,270 --> 00:42:14,319
had uh res uh

1039
00:42:18,630 --> 00:42:17,280
been appointed to the state of new uh

1040
00:42:21,030 --> 00:42:18,640
well it was the u.s

1041
00:42:22,950 --> 00:42:21,040
commission on civil rights state

1042
00:42:26,390 --> 00:42:22,960
advisory committee

1043
00:42:27,990 --> 00:42:26,400
barney had received an award from

1044
00:42:30,790 --> 00:42:28,000
sergeant shriver and the

1045
00:42:33,349 --> 00:42:30,800
governor of new hampshire for the work

1046
00:42:36,390 --> 00:42:33,359
he did through the poverty program

1047
00:42:39,190 --> 00:42:36,400
uh you know and they had been invited

1048
00:42:41,510 --> 00:42:39,200
guests at lyndon johnson's inauguration

1049
00:42:42,230 --> 00:42:41,520
and i went with them i was also invited

1050
00:42:45,109 --> 00:42:42,240
to go

1051
00:42:45,829 --> 00:42:45,119
this way before any of this came out

1052
00:42:49,030 --> 00:42:45,839
they were

1053
00:42:51,349 --> 00:42:49,040
actively known in this

1054
00:42:52,390 --> 00:42:51,359
the state of new hampshire in portsmouth

1055
00:42:55,270 --> 00:42:52,400
new hampshire and

1056
00:42:57,190 --> 00:42:55,280
rottingham county for the good work that

1057
00:42:58,470 --> 00:42:57,200
they were doing for people that was

1058
00:43:02,069 --> 00:42:58,480
their focus

1059
00:43:04,790 --> 00:43:02,079
they didn't want to talk about this ufo

1060
00:43:07,510 --> 00:43:04,800
experience except for to scientists

1061
00:43:07,829 --> 00:43:07,520
and to uh the family and close friends

1062
00:43:11,430 --> 00:43:07,839
who

1063
00:43:13,670 --> 00:43:11,440
were sworn to secrecy you know so uh

1064
00:43:15,349 --> 00:43:13,680
this was not a good thing that happened

1065
00:43:18,870 --> 00:43:15,359
to betty and barney when this

1066
00:43:19,829 --> 00:43:18,880
was released what would did they have

1067
00:43:24,069 --> 00:43:19,839
any

1068
00:43:25,910 --> 00:43:24,079
type of uh celebrity type

1069
00:43:27,829 --> 00:43:25,920
issues or anything like that they feel

1070
00:43:29,670 --> 00:43:27,839
any of that part like

1071
00:43:31,109 --> 00:43:29,680
in other words were people camping out

1072
00:43:34,790 --> 00:43:31,119
to talk to them

1073
00:43:37,990 --> 00:43:34,800
things like that well uh

1074
00:43:40,390 --> 00:43:38,000
there were uh reporters

1075
00:43:42,390 --> 00:43:40,400
who were kind of camping out or the

1076
00:43:45,430 --> 00:43:42,400
phone was ringing off the hook

1077
00:43:47,510 --> 00:43:45,440
uh they uh the first night that that

1078
00:43:51,430 --> 00:43:47,520
happened they went down to

1079
00:43:53,990 --> 00:43:51,440
uh to pease air force base uh and stayed

1080
00:43:54,870 --> 00:43:54,000
with an officer that they knew and and

1081
00:43:57,990 --> 00:43:54,880
his wife

1082
00:44:00,309 --> 00:43:58,000
and until they thought they could safely

1083
00:44:02,550 --> 00:44:00,319
return home the second night they went

1084
00:44:03,270 --> 00:44:02,560
to my grandparents house and we met as a

1085
00:44:05,349 --> 00:44:03,280
family

1086
00:44:08,230 --> 00:44:05,359
because this affected all of us as a

1087
00:44:10,470 --> 00:44:08,240
family not just betty and barney

1088
00:44:11,910 --> 00:44:10,480
this had an impact on all of us so we

1089
00:44:15,349 --> 00:44:11,920
had to decide

1090
00:44:18,309 --> 00:44:15,359
what to do next and as a family we made

1091
00:44:21,349 --> 00:44:18,319
the decision that betty and barney

1092
00:44:23,829 --> 00:44:21,359
should speak about this

1093
00:44:24,790 --> 00:44:23,839
to the public they did for the first

1094
00:44:29,349 --> 00:44:24,800
time

1095
00:44:32,950 --> 00:44:29,359
uh in early november of 1965

1096
00:44:35,990 --> 00:44:32,960
and it was well received they were

1097
00:44:38,230 --> 00:44:36,000
introduced to the crowd by the

1098
00:44:40,710 --> 00:44:38,240
public information officer from pease

1099
00:44:43,670 --> 00:44:40,720
air force base

1100
00:44:45,589 --> 00:44:43,680
so uh they and they told the story

1101
00:44:47,270 --> 00:44:45,599
that's when john fuller who wrote the

1102
00:44:50,710 --> 00:44:47,280
interrupted journey

1103
00:44:53,109 --> 00:44:50,720
met them and uh asked if they would be

1104
00:44:55,829 --> 00:44:53,119
interested in having him write a book

1105
00:44:57,510 --> 00:44:55,839
uh it took a long time for that

1106
00:44:59,990 --> 00:44:57,520
agreement to be made

1107
00:45:02,470 --> 00:45:00,000
they insisted that dr simon had to be

1108
00:45:04,470 --> 00:45:02,480
part of it

1109
00:45:05,589 --> 00:45:04,480
interesting we have another question

1110
00:45:08,630 --> 00:45:05,599
that popped up here

1111
00:45:10,150 --> 00:45:08,640
in youtube and from richard could you

1112
00:45:10,630 --> 00:45:10,160
talk about the strange things that

1113
00:45:12,630 --> 00:45:10,640
happened

1114
00:45:14,309 --> 00:45:12,640
after the abduction including the second

1115
00:45:17,990 --> 00:45:14,319
time betty saw

1116
00:45:20,230 --> 00:45:18,000
the ets in their craft

1117
00:45:21,430 --> 00:45:20,240
uh i'm not familiar with that have there

1118
00:45:24,710 --> 00:45:21,440
been

1119
00:45:26,630 --> 00:45:24,720
any recent events in recent um she

1120
00:45:33,510 --> 00:45:26,640
passed away in 2004.

1121
00:45:36,470 --> 00:45:33,520
um strange things that happened well

1122
00:45:36,950 --> 00:45:36,480
one of the very strange things was that

1123
00:45:40,150 --> 00:45:36,960
uh

1124
00:45:40,950 --> 00:45:40,160
in the fall of 1961 betty and barney

1125
00:45:43,190 --> 00:45:40,960
started

1126
00:45:44,150 --> 00:45:43,200
making trips up to the white mountains

1127
00:45:48,390 --> 00:45:44,160
to

1128
00:45:51,190 --> 00:45:48,400
the the tall trees

1129
00:45:52,870 --> 00:45:51,200
and where the the roadblock was and and

1130
00:45:56,550 --> 00:45:52,880
the fiery orb

1131
00:45:59,589 --> 00:45:56,560
and uh one time when they returned home

1132
00:46:02,069 --> 00:45:59,599
uh they unlocked the door and there

1133
00:46:03,910 --> 00:46:02,079
were leaves withered leaves on their

1134
00:46:06,150 --> 00:46:03,920
dining room table

1135
00:46:08,069 --> 00:46:06,160
that had not been there they picked them

1136
00:46:09,030 --> 00:46:08,079
up to throw them away that was pretty

1137
00:46:11,510 --> 00:46:09,040
shocking

1138
00:46:13,190 --> 00:46:11,520
and there in the middle of the leaves

1139
00:46:15,589 --> 00:46:13,200
were the earrings that barn

1140
00:46:17,190 --> 00:46:15,599
that betty was wearing on the night of

1141
00:46:18,870 --> 00:46:17,200
the abduction

1142
00:46:20,550 --> 00:46:18,880
she didn't even know they were missing

1143
00:46:24,390 --> 00:46:20,560
until she found them

1144
00:46:27,990 --> 00:46:24,400
there so that was one very weird thing

1145
00:46:29,349 --> 00:46:28,000
that happened another thing

1146
00:46:31,109 --> 00:46:29,359
that happened is their house

1147
00:46:34,150 --> 00:46:31,119
periodically was

1148
00:46:37,349 --> 00:46:34,160
uh entered and just weird

1149
00:46:39,670 --> 00:46:37,359
things were done um

1150
00:46:41,510 --> 00:46:39,680
for example let me give you one one

1151
00:46:44,870 --> 00:46:41,520
example when i

1152
00:46:48,230 --> 00:46:44,880
lived with betty after barney's uh

1153
00:46:51,349 --> 00:46:48,240
death i i moved in with her

1154
00:46:55,190 --> 00:46:51,359
i was a college student at the time

1155
00:46:59,190 --> 00:46:55,200
and commuted to unh

1156
00:47:02,150 --> 00:46:59,200
and i was downstairs studying and

1157
00:47:03,829 --> 00:47:02,160
i was down there i heard the door open

1158
00:47:07,030 --> 00:47:03,839
in betty's apartment

1159
00:47:07,670 --> 00:47:07,040
and footsteps so i went up the stairs

1160
00:47:11,430 --> 00:47:07,680
thinking that

1161
00:47:13,910 --> 00:47:11,440
betty had stopped by and

1162
00:47:15,750 --> 00:47:13,920
for some reason she was still working as

1163
00:47:18,150 --> 00:47:15,760
a social worker then

1164
00:47:19,589 --> 00:47:18,160
and she wasn't there so i thought well

1165
00:47:21,990 --> 00:47:19,599
maybe she's just left to

1166
00:47:23,349 --> 00:47:22,000
stop in and grab something went back to

1167
00:47:26,470 --> 00:47:23,359
my apartment

1168
00:47:29,270 --> 00:47:26,480
and then i heard a loud

1169
00:47:30,069 --> 00:47:29,280
crashing sound and footsteps as if

1170
00:47:33,750 --> 00:47:30,079
somebody was

1171
00:47:34,950 --> 00:47:33,760
running i ran up the stairs the closet

1172
00:47:37,510 --> 00:47:34,960
door was open

1173
00:47:38,470 --> 00:47:37,520
betty's baseball bat was on the floor

1174
00:47:40,950 --> 00:47:38,480
that was the

1175
00:47:42,870 --> 00:47:40,960
loud bang the front door to the

1176
00:47:43,430 --> 00:47:42,880
apartment was open the front door to the

1177
00:47:45,990 --> 00:47:43,440
apartment

1178
00:47:47,589 --> 00:47:46,000
house the front the gate was open and

1179
00:47:50,630 --> 00:47:47,599
there was a man dressed

1180
00:47:54,230 --> 00:47:50,640
in a beige colored uh suit

1181
00:47:54,870 --> 00:47:54,240
running up the road so that was a weird

1182
00:47:56,790 --> 00:47:54,880
thing

1183
00:47:58,549 --> 00:47:56,800
that happened there were just a number

1184
00:48:00,630 --> 00:47:58,559
of really strange

1185
00:48:02,549 --> 00:48:00,640
uh things i think it was a psychological

1186
00:48:05,349 --> 00:48:02,559
operation that was being done

1187
00:48:06,069 --> 00:48:05,359
on betty in order to just attempt to

1188
00:48:08,309 --> 00:48:06,079
discredit

1189
00:48:10,230 --> 00:48:08,319
her so that people would think that she

1190
00:48:11,510 --> 00:48:10,240
was crazy maybe they were trying to push

1191
00:48:14,309 --> 00:48:11,520
her over the edge

1192
00:48:16,390 --> 00:48:14,319
but betty was as stable as could be she

1193
00:48:19,190 --> 00:48:16,400
was a very strong woman

1194
00:48:20,069 --> 00:48:19,200
and it didn't work and she didn't tell

1195
00:48:22,549 --> 00:48:20,079
the public about

1196
00:48:24,150 --> 00:48:22,559
it what kind of person would do that i

1197
00:48:27,190 --> 00:48:24,160
mean that sounds terrible

1198
00:48:30,790 --> 00:48:27,200
uh intelligence you really think so

1199
00:48:33,750 --> 00:48:30,800
wow yeah and

1200
00:48:34,470 --> 00:48:33,760
along those lines do you think they had

1201
00:48:36,630 --> 00:48:34,480
answers

1202
00:48:38,069 --> 00:48:36,640
or things they knew about that they

1203
00:48:41,270 --> 00:48:38,079
would withheld

1204
00:48:43,109 --> 00:48:41,280
withhold or do you think they're they're

1205
00:48:46,790 --> 00:48:43,119
as clueless as everyone else

1206
00:48:48,950 --> 00:48:46,800
stanton and i

1207
00:48:49,990 --> 00:48:48,960
did a lot of research in physical

1208
00:48:54,150 --> 00:48:50,000
archives

1209
00:48:57,030 --> 00:48:54,160
and in the the military's history

1210
00:48:59,190 --> 00:48:57,040
and uh for our book fact fiction and

1211
00:49:01,750 --> 00:48:59,200
flying saucers

1212
00:49:03,990 --> 00:49:01,760
they began their study of ufos way back

1213
00:49:07,109 --> 00:49:04,000
in 1946

1214
00:49:10,470 --> 00:49:07,119
by 1947 they uh

1215
00:49:12,710 --> 00:49:10,480
realized that they were discs that could

1216
00:49:15,349 --> 00:49:12,720
outfly and out maneuver

1217
00:49:16,309 --> 00:49:15,359
anything that we had that they were

1218
00:49:19,510 --> 00:49:16,319
silent

1219
00:49:20,870 --> 00:49:19,520
uh they appeared to be metallic that

1220
00:49:24,150 --> 00:49:20,880
sort of thing

1221
00:49:27,670 --> 00:49:24,160
they did two major studies

1222
00:49:30,950 --> 00:49:27,680
one in 1952 where they attempt they took

1223
00:49:33,510 --> 00:49:30,960
reports they had mostly from

1224
00:49:35,510 --> 00:49:33,520
air force pilots of military officers

1225
00:49:38,790 --> 00:49:35,520
sometimes enlisted people

1226
00:49:40,069 --> 00:49:38,800
and a very small group of uh uh just

1227
00:49:43,030 --> 00:49:40,079
citizens who had

1228
00:49:45,270 --> 00:49:43,040
sightings in the first study that they

1229
00:49:48,470 --> 00:49:45,280
did where they tried to categorize

1230
00:49:52,390 --> 00:49:48,480
these as in prosaic

1231
00:49:56,390 --> 00:49:52,400
categories such as balloons uh

1232
00:50:01,990 --> 00:49:56,400
airplanes meteorological phenomena

1233
00:50:04,710 --> 00:50:02,000
psychological hoax etc 26.94

1234
00:50:06,870 --> 00:50:04,720
were true unknowns they could not

1235
00:50:09,270 --> 00:50:06,880
identify them as being anything

1236
00:50:11,589 --> 00:50:09,280
coming from this planet they did another

1237
00:50:14,710 --> 00:50:11,599
study the largest study ever done

1238
00:50:18,230 --> 00:50:14,720
in uh 1955

1239
00:50:19,670 --> 00:50:18,240
and uh it was bloomberg special report

1240
00:50:21,589 --> 00:50:19,680
number 14

1241
00:50:23,670 --> 00:50:21,599
done at the prestigious battelle

1242
00:50:24,950 --> 00:50:23,680
memorial institute the same kind of

1243
00:50:28,150 --> 00:50:24,960
study that was done

1244
00:50:31,349 --> 00:50:28,160
in 1952 but this time

1245
00:50:34,470 --> 00:50:31,359
there were 3201 cases

1246
00:50:35,270 --> 00:50:34,480
not the 1500 and some odd from the first

1247
00:50:38,470 --> 00:50:35,280
study

1248
00:50:39,270 --> 00:50:38,480
and there were there was a chi-square

1249
00:50:43,750 --> 00:50:39,280
analysis

1250
00:50:47,510 --> 00:50:43,760
those studies

1251
00:50:50,870 --> 00:50:47,520
and in the second study 21 and a half

1252
00:50:54,069 --> 00:50:50,880
percent were true unknowns

1253
00:50:55,270 --> 00:50:54,079
but what was most interesting is in the

1254
00:50:58,630 --> 00:50:55,280
chi-square amount

1255
00:51:01,829 --> 00:50:58,640
analysis the best observations the most

1256
00:51:05,670 --> 00:51:01,839
reliable observers and the longer the

1257
00:51:08,630 --> 00:51:05,680
observation the more likely it was to be

1258
00:51:10,150 --> 00:51:08,640
a true unknown wow

1259
00:51:12,230 --> 00:51:10,160
really interesting you really learned a

1260
00:51:14,390 --> 00:51:12,240
lot when you were doing all that

1261
00:51:16,390 --> 00:51:14,400
um we are going to be going into a break

1262
00:51:19,670 --> 00:51:16,400
i'm going to bring bring in uh

1263
00:51:20,710 --> 00:51:19,680
uh luis in just a minute here uh however

1264
00:51:22,710 --> 00:51:20,720
there's this question

1265
00:51:24,309 --> 00:51:22,720
did betty and barney feel like they were

1266
00:51:27,349 --> 00:51:24,319
chosen or ever mentioned

1267
00:51:28,630 --> 00:51:27,359
knowing about it before it happened

1268
00:51:31,270 --> 00:51:28,640
have you ever been asked that question

1269
00:51:32,230 --> 00:51:31,280
before no they didn't know about it

1270
00:51:35,030 --> 00:51:32,240
before

1271
00:51:36,230 --> 00:51:35,040
it happened barney was a firm skeptic he

1272
00:51:40,309 --> 00:51:36,240
didn't believe that

1273
00:51:43,430 --> 00:51:40,319
flying saucers existed betty wasn't sure

1274
00:51:46,150 --> 00:51:43,440
so they didn't they they had talked to

1275
00:51:50,470 --> 00:51:46,160
my mother about a sighting that she had

1276
00:51:53,190 --> 00:51:50,480
in 1957 or 1958 with another aunt and

1277
00:51:55,270 --> 00:51:53,200
a group of people um when she was

1278
00:51:56,790 --> 00:51:55,280
returning home from grocery shopping on

1279
00:51:59,990 --> 00:51:56,800
a friday night

1280
00:52:01,109 --> 00:52:00,000
but barney scoffed at it didn't believe

1281
00:52:03,589 --> 00:52:01,119
it at all

1282
00:52:05,349 --> 00:52:03,599
that i thought it was misidentification

1283
00:52:07,670 --> 00:52:05,359
not that my mother was lying

1284
00:52:08,470 --> 00:52:07,680
barty betty thought that it might be

1285
00:52:11,670 --> 00:52:08,480
true

1286
00:52:13,510 --> 00:52:11,680
but um they they betty and barney

1287
00:52:16,230 --> 00:52:13,520
thought that they just happened to be

1288
00:52:16,790 --> 00:52:16,240
in the white mountains when this uh

1289
00:52:18,630 --> 00:52:16,800
these

1290
00:52:20,549 --> 00:52:18,640
non-humans were looking for a couple of

1291
00:52:23,750 --> 00:52:20,559
humans to pick up and examine

1292
00:52:27,190 --> 00:52:23,760
that's what they thought wow interesting

1293
00:52:30,470 --> 00:52:27,200
i am going to bring in um this is uh

1294
00:52:32,870 --> 00:52:30,480
luis um from the west coast

1295
00:52:33,510 --> 00:52:32,880
and we'll all be on the stream together

1296
00:52:36,309 --> 00:52:33,520
here

1297
00:52:38,870 --> 00:52:36,319
uh for right now and uh then we'll go

1298
00:52:41,589 --> 00:52:38,880
into break here in just uh three minutes

1299
00:52:43,190 --> 00:52:41,599
welcome uh luis hey martin thanks for

1300
00:52:43,910 --> 00:52:43,200
having me it's a pleasure to be here

1301
00:52:46,790 --> 00:52:43,920
kathleen

1302
00:52:47,829 --> 00:52:46,800
pleasure to meet you my lady pleasure to

1303
00:52:49,430 --> 00:52:47,839
you too

1304
00:52:50,950 --> 00:52:49,440
hey hey mouse will ask you do you have a

1305
00:52:52,390 --> 00:52:50,960
question for kathleen

1306
00:52:54,150 --> 00:52:52,400
hey you want to know something i don't

1307
00:52:56,870 --> 00:52:54,160
really have a question i'm just going to

1308
00:53:00,390 --> 00:52:56,880
back up everything she's saying by

1309
00:53:02,870 --> 00:53:00,400
i'm going to say the time frame

1310
00:53:04,870 --> 00:53:02,880
and the relationship that was being had

1311
00:53:08,150 --> 00:53:04,880
between betty and barty hill

1312
00:53:11,910 --> 00:53:08,160
was not a normal everyday thing and

1313
00:53:14,790 --> 00:53:11,920
for them to bring attention to that

1314
00:53:15,430 --> 00:53:14,800
in in in the year that they were living

1315
00:53:19,750 --> 00:53:15,440
in

1316
00:53:22,710 --> 00:53:19,760
is to me a testament enough

1317
00:53:23,510 --> 00:53:22,720
that they're not lying uh why bring

1318
00:53:26,710 --> 00:53:23,520
attention

1319
00:53:29,030 --> 00:53:26,720
to that kind of relationship um

1320
00:53:30,549 --> 00:53:29,040
in those times it's just it doesn't make

1321
00:53:32,549 --> 00:53:30,559
any sense but i and i also found

1322
00:53:33,829 --> 00:53:32,559
fascinating the physical effects the

1323
00:53:34,630 --> 00:53:33,839
ulcers that you were talking about

1324
00:53:37,589 --> 00:53:34,640
kathleen

1325
00:53:37,910 --> 00:53:37,599
that is uh i didn't know that so you

1326
00:53:41,750 --> 00:53:37,920
know

1327
00:53:43,910 --> 00:53:41,760
um i love the betty and barney hill

1328
00:53:44,710 --> 00:53:43,920
story it's one of my favorites and i

1329
00:53:47,910 --> 00:53:44,720
think it's

1330
00:53:51,589 --> 00:53:47,920
it's i'm not a real big um

1331
00:53:53,750 --> 00:53:51,599
abductions sort of guy i don't i i don't

1332
00:53:55,349 --> 00:53:53,760
dive into that realm a whole lot i'm

1333
00:53:57,670 --> 00:53:55,359
slowly getting there

1334
00:54:00,150 --> 00:53:57,680
but this is by far and away the first

1335
00:54:00,950 --> 00:54:00,160
case i ever point anybody to if i ever

1336
00:54:04,230 --> 00:54:00,960
talk about

1337
00:54:07,829 --> 00:54:04,240
the phenomenon in that regards it's

1338
00:54:10,470 --> 00:54:07,839
really really really cool story yeah

1339
00:54:13,030 --> 00:54:10,480
it's great uh well scientifically

1340
00:54:16,309 --> 00:54:13,040
investigated case in the united states

1341
00:54:18,309 --> 00:54:16,319
right yeah that's also a big

1342
00:54:20,069 --> 00:54:18,319
you know a big sort of check mark to say

1343
00:54:21,510 --> 00:54:20,079
hey this was looked at legitimately as

1344
00:54:25,829 --> 00:54:21,520
well

1345
00:54:28,069 --> 00:54:25,839
for us to go into break

1346
00:54:28,950 --> 00:54:28,079
so um kathleen i'm going to remove you

1347
00:54:31,270 --> 00:54:28,960
from the stream

1348
00:54:32,950 --> 00:54:31,280
and we'll bring you back in in a little

1349
00:54:34,950 --> 00:54:32,960
bit

1350
00:54:36,710 --> 00:54:34,960
and our every all right everyone over at

1351
00:54:39,030 --> 00:54:36,720
kgra radio

1352
00:54:47,270 --> 00:54:39,040
we'll be right back right after these

1353
00:54:52,870 --> 00:54:50,470
okay we should be clear here um

1354
00:54:53,750 --> 00:54:52,880
and i gotta remember to bring uh bill in

1355
00:54:56,630 --> 00:54:53,760
but hey

1356
00:54:59,270 --> 00:54:56,640
uh let's talk first of all uh people are

1357
00:55:01,349 --> 00:54:59,280
saying who is this guy

1358
00:55:03,109 --> 00:55:01,359
yeah where'd he come from it's a great

1359
00:55:07,109 --> 00:55:03,119
question i'm nobody

1360
00:55:10,789 --> 00:55:07,119
i am nobody

1361
00:55:14,390 --> 00:55:10,799
i am very much a new person in this

1362
00:55:16,789 --> 00:55:14,400
uh field um i don't i'm not a researcher

1363
00:55:18,829 --> 00:55:16,799
i'm just an actor in los angeles that

1364
00:55:20,069 --> 00:55:18,839
has a really strong passion for this

1365
00:55:22,549 --> 00:55:20,079
topic

1366
00:55:23,670 --> 00:55:22,559
that's it yeah but let's talk about what

1367
00:55:27,349 --> 00:55:23,680
you're doing

1368
00:55:28,069 --> 00:55:27,359
um so basically um after speaking with

1369
00:55:30,630 --> 00:55:28,079
you

1370
00:55:32,150 --> 00:55:30,640
and after specifically right before

1371
00:55:34,470 --> 00:55:32,160
after speaking with you and right before

1372
00:55:36,630 --> 00:55:34,480
i spoke to alejandra rojas

1373
00:55:38,309 --> 00:55:36,640
i noticed that sometimes you guys would

1374
00:55:40,470 --> 00:55:38,319
end your shows with

1375
00:55:41,829 --> 00:55:40,480
you know if you want more information if

1376
00:55:43,349 --> 00:55:41,839
you want more uh

1377
00:55:45,430 --> 00:55:43,359
data you have to call your

1378
00:55:47,430 --> 00:55:45,440
representatives you know and

1379
00:55:50,230 --> 00:55:47,440
and i always thought to myself man

1380
00:55:53,430 --> 00:55:50,240
that's a really important message but

1381
00:55:54,069 --> 00:55:53,440
how do we actually convince people to do

1382
00:55:56,309 --> 00:55:54,079
that

1383
00:55:58,390 --> 00:55:56,319
because it's you know it's really hard

1384
00:56:00,390 --> 00:55:58,400
to um

1385
00:56:02,309 --> 00:56:00,400
first of all remember to say that but

1386
00:56:03,109 --> 00:56:02,319
but to try and convince people to yeah

1387
00:56:05,349 --> 00:56:03,119
actually

1388
00:56:06,390 --> 00:56:05,359
physically pick up their phone dial a

1389
00:56:08,390 --> 00:56:06,400
phone number

1390
00:56:10,470 --> 00:56:08,400
and request information for our

1391
00:56:12,630 --> 00:56:10,480
government on the topic of uaps

1392
00:56:14,150 --> 00:56:12,640
so that's how this idea started and

1393
00:56:16,309 --> 00:56:14,160
that's what i'm doing

1394
00:56:18,069 --> 00:56:16,319
is i'm doing an eight-hour live stream

1395
00:56:20,390 --> 00:56:18,079
for my channel i've invited

1396
00:56:21,270 --> 00:56:20,400
um former government officials

1397
00:56:24,710 --> 00:56:21,280
journalists

1398
00:56:27,270 --> 00:56:24,720
scientists um in floors within the uap

1399
00:56:29,349 --> 00:56:27,280
field and outside of the uap field and

1400
00:56:32,470 --> 00:56:29,359
everyday average modes like myself

1401
00:56:33,109 --> 00:56:32,480
and i am encouraging all of the guests

1402
00:56:35,990 --> 00:56:33,119
on my show

1403
00:56:38,069 --> 00:56:36,000
to encourage their audiences and really

1404
00:56:41,109 --> 00:56:38,079
really give them the tools

1405
00:56:41,829 --> 00:56:41,119
and show them how to interact with their

1406
00:56:43,589 --> 00:56:41,839
government

1407
00:56:47,270 --> 00:56:43,599
so you just brought up the website this

1408
00:56:50,470 --> 00:56:47,280
is our website www.thebigphonehome.com

1409
00:56:51,589 --> 00:56:50,480
when you go to this website you put in

1410
00:56:53,270 --> 00:56:51,599
your email address

1411
00:56:54,870 --> 00:56:53,280
and it will give you access to a

1412
00:56:58,390 --> 00:56:54,880
downloadable

1413
00:56:59,910 --> 00:56:58,400
list that you can uh go through it's uh

1414
00:57:01,910 --> 00:56:59,920
it's got the senate

1415
00:57:03,910 --> 00:57:01,920
uh all of congress first of all i've got

1416
00:57:05,910 --> 00:57:03,920
it's got every member of congress and

1417
00:57:08,870 --> 00:57:05,920
every member of the senate

1418
00:57:10,549 --> 00:57:08,880
that have to do with one of six

1419
00:57:12,230 --> 00:57:10,559
committees or subcommittees and those

1420
00:57:14,069 --> 00:57:12,240
committees are the judiciary

1421
00:57:16,390 --> 00:57:14,079
the intelligence the oversight reform

1422
00:57:18,230 --> 00:57:16,400
the homeland security appropriations

1423
00:57:19,510 --> 00:57:18,240
space science detect and the armed

1424
00:57:21,109 --> 00:57:19,520
services committee

1425
00:57:22,630 --> 00:57:21,119
these are the six committees that have a

1426
00:57:25,589 --> 00:57:22,640
direct or indirect

1427
00:57:27,109 --> 00:57:25,599
knowledge of the uap phenomenon and

1428
00:57:30,150 --> 00:57:27,119
basically what we're doing

1429
00:57:32,630 --> 00:57:30,160
is we're calling on saturday april 24th

1430
00:57:33,670 --> 00:57:32,640
2021 and we're going to be leaving

1431
00:57:36,069 --> 00:57:33,680
voicemails

1432
00:57:38,630 --> 00:57:36,079
and we're going to be reaching out on uh

1433
00:57:41,829 --> 00:57:38,640
twitter and social media

1434
00:57:43,910 --> 00:57:41,839
to encourage people to call congress and

1435
00:57:46,470 --> 00:57:43,920
call these senate intelligence

1436
00:57:47,510 --> 00:57:46,480
members and request more transparency

1437
00:57:49,430 --> 00:57:47,520
more data

1438
00:57:50,950 --> 00:57:49,440
and also we're asking there's a lot of

1439
00:57:52,470 --> 00:57:50,960
things we're asking for we have a script

1440
00:57:54,549 --> 00:57:52,480
also on our website

1441
00:57:55,829 --> 00:57:54,559
um you can check out the script and it

1442
00:57:56,390 --> 00:57:55,839
just basically shows you everything

1443
00:57:58,470 --> 00:57:56,400
we're doing

1444
00:57:59,430 --> 00:57:58,480
uh and how to ask for information go on

1445
00:58:02,870 --> 00:57:59,440
sorry guys hang on

1446
00:58:06,069 --> 00:58:02,880
go ahead here we go three two one

1447
00:58:09,270 --> 00:58:06,079
go welcome back uh this is martin willis

1448
00:58:11,990 --> 00:58:09,280
and right now i have uh luis gimez

1449
00:58:12,950 --> 00:58:12,000
um on with me and i hope i pronounce

1450
00:58:14,950 --> 00:58:12,960
your name

1451
00:58:17,910 --> 00:58:14,960
it's jimenez but that's fine jimenez

1452
00:58:21,430 --> 00:58:19,910
i always have trouble with spanish uh

1453
00:58:22,390 --> 00:58:21,440
well some people would argue i have

1454
00:58:25,109 --> 00:58:22,400
trouble with most

1455
00:58:27,670 --> 00:58:25,119
names and pronunciations that's totally

1456
00:58:30,470 --> 00:58:27,680
understandable martin don't sweat it

1457
00:58:31,349 --> 00:58:30,480
but uh yeah so this is really great and

1458
00:58:33,190 --> 00:58:31,359
um

1459
00:58:34,710 --> 00:58:33,200
i'm going to bring uh kathleen back in

1460
00:58:36,950 --> 00:58:34,720
just to join us

1461
00:58:38,710 --> 00:58:36,960
um so i i'll be on at some point i know

1462
00:58:39,589 --> 00:58:38,720
i filled out your thing at a time i

1463
00:58:42,069 --> 00:58:39,599
think 2 p.m

1464
00:58:43,270 --> 00:58:42,079
uh eastern time i'll be on your stream

1465
00:58:44,870 --> 00:58:43,280
for a few minutes i was trying to get

1466
00:58:45,349 --> 00:58:44,880
alejandro to come on with me he seems

1467
00:58:46,870 --> 00:58:45,359
like he's

1468
00:58:48,789 --> 00:58:46,880
really really busy right now with the

1469
00:58:51,109 --> 00:58:48,799
yeah new thing he's doing

1470
00:58:52,710 --> 00:58:51,119
so i love it busy is a good thing you

1471
00:58:54,230 --> 00:58:52,720
know uh but yeah essentially we're going

1472
00:58:55,190 --> 00:58:54,240
to be inviting

1473
00:58:58,309 --> 00:58:55,200
all sorts of people we're going to have

1474
00:59:00,390 --> 00:58:58,319
louis lozando sean cahill uh yourself

1475
00:59:01,910 --> 00:59:00,400
jeremy corbell and everyone's going to

1476
00:59:02,630 --> 00:59:01,920
come on we're going to have round table

1477
00:59:05,349 --> 00:59:02,640
discussions

1478
00:59:07,270 --> 00:59:05,359
from 10 a.m to 6 p.m an eight-hour

1479
00:59:08,870 --> 00:59:07,280
livestream hosted from my channel

1480
00:59:10,630 --> 00:59:08,880
which is the unidentified celebrity

1481
00:59:11,910 --> 00:59:10,640
review we're going to be calling comp

1482
00:59:13,190 --> 00:59:11,920
members of congress we're going to be

1483
00:59:14,630 --> 00:59:13,200
calling members of the senate

1484
00:59:15,190 --> 00:59:14,640
specifically the senate intelligence

1485
00:59:17,349 --> 00:59:15,200
committee

1486
00:59:19,030 --> 00:59:17,359
and we're going to be requesting not

1487
00:59:22,309 --> 00:59:19,040
demanding but requesting

1488
00:59:24,789 --> 00:59:22,319
more uap information and transparency

1489
00:59:26,390 --> 00:59:24,799
um and specifically in regards to the

1490
00:59:27,589 --> 00:59:26,400
180-day report

1491
00:59:29,270 --> 00:59:27,599
we're going to be asking for an

1492
00:59:31,030 --> 00:59:29,280
extension to that report an additional

1493
00:59:34,470 --> 00:59:31,040
180 days to let these

1494
00:59:35,589 --> 00:59:34,480
uh these uh intelligence agencies or

1495
00:59:37,190 --> 00:59:35,599
apparatuses

1496
00:59:39,510 --> 00:59:37,200
coordinate and put together a more

1497
00:59:42,789 --> 00:59:39,520
substantial report in the meantime

1498
00:59:43,270 --> 00:59:42,799
we want a preliminary report so and we

1499
00:59:46,630 --> 00:59:43,280
also

1500
00:59:50,069 --> 00:59:46,640
are requesting um a yearly uap

1501
00:59:50,390 --> 00:59:50,079
report we want a report every year we

1502
00:59:53,990 --> 00:59:50,400
want

1503
00:59:57,430 --> 00:59:54,000
look at this data

1504
00:59:59,670 --> 00:59:57,440
we want the discussion to be removed

1505
01:00:01,430 --> 00:59:59,680
from the taboo and the stigma and we

1506
01:00:04,309 --> 01:00:01,440
want this to be

1507
01:00:05,670 --> 01:00:04,319
a discussion that brings people together

1508
01:00:06,789 --> 01:00:05,680
because the beautiful thing about this

1509
01:00:09,670 --> 01:00:06,799
topic

1510
01:00:11,030 --> 01:00:09,680
is that it's bipartisan it's it reaches

1511
01:00:13,270 --> 01:00:11,040
across aisles

1512
01:00:15,030 --> 01:00:13,280
everyone is interested in this in this

1513
01:00:17,750 --> 01:00:15,040
question and this discussion

1514
01:00:19,990 --> 01:00:17,760
so it's really simple um if you follow

1515
01:00:21,990 --> 01:00:20,000
me on twitter lou angelus i've been

1516
01:00:23,589 --> 01:00:22,000
tweeting all for the last two days

1517
01:00:24,230 --> 01:00:23,599
especially this week leading up to the

1518
01:00:26,950 --> 01:00:24,240
event

1519
01:00:28,630 --> 01:00:26,960
is so important that we that we reach

1520
01:00:30,309 --> 01:00:28,640
out to these senators we reach out to

1521
01:00:33,270 --> 01:00:30,319
these congressmen and we

1522
01:00:34,549 --> 01:00:33,280
request this information um and that's

1523
01:00:35,589 --> 01:00:34,559
basically what i'm doing that's what's

1524
01:00:37,910 --> 01:00:35,599
going on

1525
01:00:40,309 --> 01:00:37,920
well just a couple of things yeah let's

1526
01:00:41,990 --> 01:00:40,319
see first of all that is

1527
01:00:44,549 --> 01:00:42,000
uh i i do believe it's going to take

1528
01:00:47,109 --> 01:00:44,559
more than 180 days because i just heard

1529
01:00:48,470 --> 01:00:47,119
the rumor that that is that's not going

1530
01:00:50,950 --> 01:00:48,480
to be enough time

1531
01:00:51,990 --> 01:00:50,960
i don't know what marco rubio said has

1532
01:00:54,630 --> 01:00:52,000
said it himself

1533
01:00:55,589 --> 01:00:54,640
he said it publicly that expect this to

1534
01:00:57,430 --> 01:00:55,599
be delayed

1535
01:00:59,349 --> 01:00:57,440
because everything in government is

1536
01:01:02,309 --> 01:00:59,359
delayed everything is slow

1537
01:01:02,710 --> 01:01:02,319
that's just the facts and unfortunately

1538
01:01:05,589 --> 01:01:02,720
we're

1539
01:01:07,030 --> 01:01:05,599
in a position where we have to wait and

1540
01:01:08,950 --> 01:01:07,040
who care what's in

1541
01:01:10,950 --> 01:01:08,960
if you've been interested in this topic

1542
01:01:11,190 --> 01:01:10,960
especially for as long as you guys have

1543
01:01:15,270 --> 01:01:11,200
is

1544
01:01:18,390 --> 01:01:15,280
topic

1545
01:01:21,430 --> 01:01:18,400
what is another 180 days to get more

1546
01:01:22,309 --> 01:01:21,440
and better data like that's nothing

1547
01:01:25,270 --> 01:01:22,319
it'll it'll come

1548
01:01:26,150 --> 01:01:25,280
it'll go in in a blink of an eye it's

1549
01:01:29,510 --> 01:01:26,160
all you know

1550
01:01:32,230 --> 01:01:29,520
so let's give them the time so that way

1551
01:01:34,470 --> 01:01:32,240
come another 180 days there won't be any

1552
01:01:36,549 --> 01:01:34,480
excuses because we've given you the time

1553
01:01:38,069 --> 01:01:36,559
we've requested the data and it also

1554
01:01:40,390 --> 01:01:38,079
gives us more time to

1555
01:01:41,670 --> 01:01:40,400
keep not pestering them but requesting

1556
01:01:43,109 --> 01:01:41,680
them hey

1557
01:01:45,109 --> 01:01:43,119
this is what we want this is what we're

1558
01:01:47,910 --> 01:01:45,119
looking for this has got to be

1559
01:01:48,630 --> 01:01:47,920
a look in the mirror moment if you

1560
01:01:56,069 --> 01:01:48,640
really

1561
01:01:58,470 --> 01:01:56,079
more data you have to call

1562
01:01:59,510 --> 01:01:58,480
your representatives local and state

1563
01:02:01,750 --> 01:01:59,520
representatives

1564
01:02:03,829 --> 01:02:01,760
and we've put that list together to you

1565
01:02:04,710 --> 01:02:03,839
for you and if our list is too difficult

1566
01:02:07,270 --> 01:02:04,720
to navigate

1567
01:02:09,109 --> 01:02:07,280
totally understandable go to james fox's

1568
01:02:11,270 --> 01:02:09,119
website uap act now

1569
01:02:12,630 --> 01:02:11,280
and he's got pretty much the exact same

1570
01:02:14,870 --> 01:02:12,640
thing going on over there

1571
01:02:16,470 --> 01:02:14,880
and he's got a much easier and his tools

1572
01:02:18,950 --> 01:02:16,480
are much much faster

1573
01:02:19,750 --> 01:02:18,960
to get these messages out but i will

1574
01:02:22,390 --> 01:02:19,760
tell you

1575
01:02:23,510 --> 01:02:22,400
if you make these messages more personal

1576
01:02:26,390 --> 01:02:23,520
they have a less

1577
01:02:27,270 --> 01:02:26,400
chance of being filtered out because

1578
01:02:29,430 --> 01:02:27,280
they are a

1579
01:02:31,029 --> 01:02:29,440
there is ai not only in the telephone

1580
01:02:33,270 --> 01:02:31,039
systems but on the twitter

1581
01:02:34,069 --> 01:02:33,280
handles that filter out messages that

1582
01:02:35,829 --> 01:02:34,079
repeat

1583
01:02:37,750 --> 01:02:35,839
so if you could personalize it a little

1584
01:02:41,029 --> 01:02:37,760
bit i think it goes even farther

1585
01:02:43,430 --> 01:02:41,039
let me ask you this also the

1586
01:02:44,470 --> 01:02:43,440
uh that day the 24th is this coming

1587
01:02:47,349 --> 01:02:44,480
saturday

1588
01:02:48,230 --> 01:02:47,359
and how how responsive are people on a

1589
01:02:50,230 --> 01:02:48,240
saturday that's

1590
01:02:51,750 --> 01:02:50,240
you know well here's there's a reason

1591
01:02:53,109 --> 01:02:51,760
why we did that first of all

1592
01:02:55,670 --> 01:02:53,119
it's the anniversary of the lonnie

1593
01:02:58,390 --> 01:02:55,680
zamora case so you know that's also

1594
01:02:58,710 --> 01:02:58,400
a pretty cool coincidence but the real

1595
01:03:02,069 --> 01:02:58,720
yeah

1596
01:03:05,109 --> 01:03:02,079
or sequoia correct uh the uh the

1597
01:03:08,710 --> 01:03:05,119
real reason why we did this is

1598
01:03:10,390 --> 01:03:08,720
take today for example the um the

1599
01:03:13,109 --> 01:03:10,400
the adjudication of these police

1600
01:03:15,829 --> 01:03:13,119
officers uh in minnesota

1601
01:03:16,789 --> 01:03:15,839
there might be anger there might be

1602
01:03:19,829 --> 01:03:16,799
passions

1603
01:03:22,710 --> 01:03:19,839
uh for an incident like this

1604
01:03:24,950 --> 01:03:22,720
if we are trying to call in say on the

1605
01:03:26,069 --> 01:03:24,960
same day like of something like that

1606
01:03:27,829 --> 01:03:26,079
happens

1607
01:03:29,990 --> 01:03:27,839
i don't want this event to be the

1608
01:03:32,470 --> 01:03:30,000
scapegoat as to the reason why

1609
01:03:34,470 --> 01:03:32,480
people couldn't call into their their

1610
01:03:36,950 --> 01:03:34,480
representatives and express their

1611
01:03:37,670 --> 01:03:36,960
angers and concerns for something that

1612
01:03:40,230 --> 01:03:37,680
you know

1613
01:03:40,789 --> 01:03:40,240
that really affects the human psyche

1614
01:03:44,230 --> 01:03:40,799
like

1615
01:03:44,630 --> 01:03:44,240
this is not an issue where somebody lost

1616
01:03:47,430 --> 01:03:44,640
their

1617
01:03:48,789 --> 01:03:47,440
mother you know at the hands of a brutal

1618
01:03:50,630 --> 01:03:48,799
attack to somebody

1619
01:03:51,990 --> 01:03:50,640
this is not an issue where we should be

1620
01:03:55,750 --> 01:03:52,000
calling and being

1621
01:03:56,789 --> 01:03:55,760
angry so that's why we're doing it on a

1622
01:04:01,270 --> 01:03:56,799
saturday

1623
01:04:03,990 --> 01:04:01,280
more people are available to call

1624
01:04:04,870 --> 01:04:04,000
so if we pack those voicemails with our

1625
01:04:07,109 --> 01:04:04,880
messages

1626
01:04:08,390 --> 01:04:07,119
and we pack those twitter handles with

1627
01:04:11,829 --> 01:04:08,400
our messages

1628
01:04:14,470 --> 01:04:11,839
i promise you that will have a huge

1629
01:04:15,190 --> 01:04:14,480
impact and also i think will open the

1630
01:04:17,990 --> 01:04:15,200
dialogue

1631
01:04:20,230 --> 01:04:18,000
for future events like this to bring on

1632
01:04:23,109 --> 01:04:20,240
senators and bring on congressmen

1633
01:04:23,990 --> 01:04:23,119
so we can publicly start having this

1634
01:04:26,470 --> 01:04:24,000
dialogue

1635
01:04:27,109 --> 01:04:26,480
we don't want to annoy congress in the

1636
01:04:29,349 --> 01:04:27,119
senate

1637
01:04:30,150 --> 01:04:29,359
we want to kindly request this

1638
01:04:32,470 --> 01:04:30,160
information

1639
01:04:34,309 --> 01:04:32,480
so that was part of the motivation as to

1640
01:04:35,990 --> 01:04:34,319
why we're doing it on a saturday

1641
01:04:37,430 --> 01:04:36,000
initially we were going to do it on the

1642
01:04:39,109 --> 01:04:37,440
monday but

1643
01:04:40,630 --> 01:04:39,119
after talking to some people after

1644
01:04:42,230 --> 01:04:40,640
really looking at this and trying to

1645
01:04:43,990 --> 01:04:42,240
strategize this

1646
01:04:46,230 --> 01:04:44,000
that was i think the best course of

1647
01:04:49,349 --> 01:04:46,240
action just to try and avoid

1648
01:04:51,750 --> 01:04:49,359
um being a scapegoat or or god forbid

1649
01:04:53,750 --> 01:04:51,760
we just happen to land on a day where a

1650
01:04:56,710 --> 01:04:53,760
black lives matter protests

1651
01:04:58,390 --> 01:04:56,720
breaks out or something where people are

1652
01:04:59,349 --> 01:04:58,400
really angry and looking for social

1653
01:05:01,750 --> 01:04:59,359
justice

1654
01:05:02,870 --> 01:05:01,760
um so that's the motivation the reason

1655
01:05:06,630 --> 01:05:02,880
behind that

1656
01:05:08,069 --> 01:05:06,640
i see well um i think

1657
01:05:09,829 --> 01:05:08,079
yeah and a monday would have been a

1658
01:05:11,829 --> 01:05:09,839
terrible idea by the way

1659
01:05:13,430 --> 01:05:11,839
yeah mondays yeah it's really a busy day

1660
01:05:15,589 --> 01:05:13,440
i'm sure extremely busy day

1661
01:05:18,630 --> 01:05:15,599
yeah extremely busy but here's the thing

1662
01:05:20,309 --> 01:05:18,640
is you can take this website

1663
01:05:22,309 --> 01:05:20,319
any one of these two websites that i

1664
01:05:24,069 --> 01:05:22,319
told you about and you can do this any

1665
01:05:25,829 --> 01:05:24,079
day you want

1666
01:05:27,510 --> 01:05:25,839
any day this doesn't have to be on the

1667
01:05:29,750 --> 01:05:27,520
24th you want to do this

1668
01:05:31,589 --> 01:05:29,760
right now you can do it and that's what

1669
01:05:34,309 --> 01:05:31,599
i've been doing all day today is just

1670
01:05:36,230 --> 01:05:34,319
sending out lists of committee members

1671
01:05:36,950 --> 01:05:36,240
all from the minority and the majority

1672
01:05:39,750 --> 01:05:36,960
members

1673
01:05:40,390 --> 01:05:39,760
and and making them aware of the 180-day

1674
01:05:41,750 --> 01:05:40,400
report

1675
01:05:43,430 --> 01:05:41,760
making them aware of some of the

1676
01:05:44,630 --> 01:05:43,440
requests that we're asking for telling

1677
01:05:46,470 --> 01:05:44,640
them about our website

1678
01:05:48,390 --> 01:05:46,480
and pointing them to and inviting them

1679
01:05:50,309 --> 01:05:48,400
to join us you know that's

1680
01:05:52,630 --> 01:05:50,319
that's what we got to do this has got to

1681
01:05:54,549 --> 01:05:52,640
be no matter what your belief system is

1682
01:05:55,910 --> 01:05:54,559
as well in this ufo community

1683
01:05:57,750 --> 01:05:55,920
you believe bottles are you don't

1684
01:05:58,950 --> 01:05:57,760
believe bob zlar you believe in lizard

1685
01:06:00,470 --> 01:05:58,960
people you don't believe in lizard

1686
01:06:01,829 --> 01:06:00,480
people you believe in alien bases you

1687
01:06:05,430 --> 01:06:01,839
don't believe in alien bases

1688
01:06:08,870 --> 01:06:05,440
i don't care i don't care what we can

1689
01:06:11,349 --> 01:06:08,880
all come together on is that we all know

1690
01:06:12,470 --> 01:06:11,359
the government has more information on

1691
01:06:15,270 --> 01:06:12,480
this topic

1692
01:06:16,549 --> 01:06:15,280
so instead of pointing at each other

1693
01:06:22,950 --> 01:06:16,559
let's start pointing

1694
01:06:24,390 --> 01:06:22,960
this emotion and this passion upwards

1695
01:06:26,390 --> 01:06:24,400
and i promise you

1696
01:06:27,750 --> 01:06:26,400
it will yield results and that's the

1697
01:06:29,430 --> 01:06:27,760
whole point of the big phone

1698
01:06:30,950 --> 01:06:29,440
and that's what we're trying to do

1699
01:06:34,150 --> 01:06:30,960
excellent well it's

1700
01:06:35,190 --> 01:06:34,160
uh thebigphonehome.com thank you so much

1701
01:06:36,950 --> 01:06:35,200
uh luis it's

1702
01:06:38,789 --> 01:06:36,960
always a pleasure always fun talking to

1703
01:06:41,190 --> 01:06:38,799
you martin willis

1704
01:06:42,230 --> 01:06:41,200
you are a god amongst men sir thank you

1705
01:06:43,750 --> 01:06:42,240
for having me

1706
01:06:45,430 --> 01:06:43,760
thank you for talking about this

1707
01:06:47,829 --> 01:06:45,440
kathleen

1708
01:06:49,750 --> 01:06:47,839
if it's okay please have martin uh

1709
01:06:50,789 --> 01:06:49,760
afford me your information i'd love to

1710
01:06:53,910 --> 01:06:50,799
have you on the show

1711
01:06:56,069 --> 01:06:53,920
and talk to you all about uh

1712
01:06:57,029 --> 01:06:56,079
uh betty and barney hill it would be

1713
01:07:00,470 --> 01:06:57,039
amazing

1714
01:07:01,349 --> 01:07:00,480
okay yeah all right awesome i think she

1715
01:07:03,990 --> 01:07:01,359
said okay

1716
01:07:05,670 --> 01:07:04,000
guys she sure did we have it on today

1717
01:07:07,109 --> 01:07:05,680
i'm holding her to it holding it to it

1718
01:07:08,549 --> 01:07:07,119
well i appreciate all of your help

1719
01:07:09,270 --> 01:07:08,559
martin and uh and i'll see you on

1720
01:07:10,549 --> 01:07:09,280
saturday

1721
01:07:12,630 --> 01:07:10,559
you bet all right take care all right

1722
01:07:14,630 --> 01:07:12,640
sir bye-bye all right bye

1723
01:07:15,990 --> 01:07:14,640
all right excellent uh that's great to

1724
01:07:19,109 --> 01:07:16,000
see new energy like that in

1725
01:07:22,150 --> 01:07:19,119
in this field i love it

1726
01:07:25,109 --> 01:07:22,160
it uh yeah um and people

1727
01:07:25,990 --> 01:07:25,119
like that can change things so it's

1728
01:07:28,710 --> 01:07:26,000
excellent

1729
01:07:30,630 --> 01:07:28,720
he has a lot of enthusiasm he sure does

1730
01:07:32,870 --> 01:07:30,640
i love that

1731
01:07:34,069 --> 01:07:32,880
and you know i forget where we were at

1732
01:07:36,870 --> 01:07:34,079
when we were talking

1733
01:07:38,150 --> 01:07:36,880
exactly um but i think what i wanted to

1734
01:07:40,870 --> 01:07:38,160
find out was

1735
01:07:42,150 --> 01:07:40,880
uh you know what it was like for you

1736
01:07:44,710 --> 01:07:42,160
growing up

1737
01:07:46,309 --> 01:07:44,720
um you know before you really took this

1738
01:07:47,750 --> 01:07:46,319
topic seriously i mean

1739
01:07:49,430 --> 01:07:47,760
i believe were you a teacher or

1740
01:07:53,029 --> 01:07:49,440
something like that you did some

1741
01:07:54,069 --> 01:07:53,039
some type of uh you had i started out as

1742
01:07:57,430 --> 01:07:54,079
a social worker

1743
01:08:00,630 --> 01:07:57,440
social worker okay well i uh went into

1744
01:08:04,549 --> 01:08:00,640
i was in psychiatric social work but

1745
01:08:06,870 --> 01:08:04,559
i my first husband was

1746
01:08:08,710 --> 01:08:06,880
earning his phd at the philosophy in

1747
01:08:10,390 --> 01:08:08,720
philosophy of psychiatry

1748
01:08:11,750 --> 01:08:10,400
at the university of cincinnati i

1749
01:08:14,390 --> 01:08:11,760
couldn't get a job as

1750
01:08:15,109 --> 01:08:14,400
in psychiatric social work but i could

1751
01:08:17,110 --> 01:08:15,119
get a job

1752
01:08:18,229 --> 01:08:17,120
teaching in the inner city so i did

1753
01:08:21,349 --> 01:08:18,239
graduate work

1754
01:08:23,669 --> 01:08:21,359
in education i was a teacher for

1755
01:08:26,070 --> 01:08:23,679
about 14 years i was an education

1756
01:08:29,990 --> 01:08:26,080
services coordinator as well

1757
01:08:31,669 --> 01:08:30,000
so that's professional history before i

1758
01:08:34,709 --> 01:08:31,679
became an investigator and

1759
01:08:38,309 --> 01:08:34,719
professional writer

1760
01:08:40,149 --> 01:08:38,319
and um so i'm going to ask you kind of

1761
01:08:43,349 --> 01:08:40,159
an odd question do you think that

1762
01:08:45,110 --> 01:08:43,359
any part of your path for your career

1763
01:08:46,630 --> 01:08:45,120
was shaped in any type of way by the

1764
01:08:49,749 --> 01:08:46,640
incident

1765
01:08:51,590 --> 01:08:49,759
absolutely absolutely the reason that i

1766
01:08:52,630 --> 01:08:51,600
studied psychiatric social work was

1767
01:08:55,349 --> 01:08:52,640
because

1768
01:08:57,910 --> 01:08:55,359
of what betty and barney went through

1769
01:09:00,550 --> 01:08:57,920
and and barney's reaction to it

1770
01:09:02,950 --> 01:09:00,560
um you know if i probably would never

1771
01:09:06,149 --> 01:09:02,960
have an interest in ufos

1772
01:09:09,110 --> 01:09:06,159
if if this hadn't happened i immediately

1773
01:09:10,470 --> 01:09:09,120
as a a 13 year old developed an interest

1774
01:09:12,709 --> 01:09:10,480
in astronomy

1775
01:09:14,149 --> 01:09:12,719
and my father bought a telescope for me

1776
01:09:17,030 --> 01:09:14,159
and we went out and

1777
01:09:18,950 --> 01:09:17,040
and looked at the sky at night and wow

1778
01:09:22,309 --> 01:09:18,960
you know so

1779
01:09:24,870 --> 01:09:22,319
yeah um i admired those

1780
01:09:26,229 --> 01:09:24,880
investigators i met most of the original

1781
01:09:29,269 --> 01:09:26,239
investigators

1782
01:09:30,550 --> 01:09:29,279
of betty's and barney's case uh i went

1783
01:09:33,829 --> 01:09:30,560
to dinner at dr

1784
01:09:35,749 --> 01:09:33,839
simon's house john fuller was there and

1785
01:09:37,749 --> 01:09:35,759
alan heineck was there

1786
01:09:40,070 --> 01:09:37,759
and and betty and barney and that was

1787
01:09:40,630 --> 01:09:40,080
the the first time that dr simon had

1788
01:09:43,910 --> 01:09:40,640
ever

1789
01:09:47,030 --> 01:09:43,920
hypnotized the two of them together

1790
01:09:48,070 --> 01:09:47,040
and uh they sat them down in chairs and

1791
01:09:51,269 --> 01:09:48,080
had them

1792
01:09:51,910 --> 01:09:51,279
uh re-live together what they were going

1793
01:09:55,350 --> 01:09:51,920
through

1794
01:09:57,910 --> 01:09:55,360
did this happen in front of heineck and

1795
01:09:58,630 --> 01:09:57,920
fuller yes it did and heinek wrote about

1796
01:10:02,630 --> 01:09:58,640
it in

1797
01:10:03,830 --> 01:10:02,640
one of his books yes wow wow amazing i

1798
01:10:05,830 --> 01:10:03,840
never heard that part of it

1799
01:10:07,590 --> 01:10:05,840
now i wanted to ask you a friend and

1800
01:10:10,870 --> 01:10:07,600
he's been on the show a number of times

1801
01:10:11,350 --> 01:10:10,880
bryce zabel oh yeah he was he was

1802
01:10:14,790 --> 01:10:11,360
writing

1803
01:10:16,630 --> 01:10:14,800
was it a series or was it a uh

1804
01:10:18,149 --> 01:10:16,640
was it a single movie he was writing

1805
01:10:21,189 --> 01:10:18,159
about betty and barney

1806
01:10:23,590 --> 01:10:21,199
uh a series a series is that

1807
01:10:25,669 --> 01:10:23,600
what do we know about that well it's

1808
01:10:29,430 --> 01:10:25,679
still in the works he has a partner

1809
01:10:32,390 --> 01:10:29,440
um he's met with people but i don't know

1810
01:10:32,950 --> 01:10:32,400
um if i don't know what's going to

1811
01:10:34,630 --> 01:10:32,960
happen

1812
01:10:36,790 --> 01:10:34,640
yeah i mean with covet everything kind

1813
01:10:38,310 --> 01:10:36,800
of changed i i know he was

1814
01:10:40,630 --> 01:10:38,320
involved with the production company it

1815
01:10:43,110 --> 01:10:40,640
was it was pretty serious

1816
01:10:44,310 --> 01:10:43,120
so um that would be uh that will be

1817
01:10:47,110 --> 01:10:44,320
interesting when that i mean

1818
01:10:48,390 --> 01:10:47,120
bryce does things right i mean he's he's

1819
01:10:49,990 --> 01:10:48,400
he really does his uh

1820
01:10:51,430 --> 01:10:50,000
his research and work i mean he's a

1821
01:10:53,189 --> 01:10:51,440
great writer too

1822
01:10:55,030 --> 01:10:53,199
so i'm sure he'll do a really nice job

1823
01:10:58,470 --> 01:10:55,040
with that yes he's

1824
01:11:01,830 --> 01:10:58,480
i i like him because i know

1825
01:11:04,550 --> 01:11:01,840
that he is not going to focus on horror

1826
01:11:06,070 --> 01:11:04,560
that he is going to treat this story

1827
01:11:08,550 --> 01:11:06,080
sensitively

1828
01:11:09,830 --> 01:11:08,560
uh in terms of who betty and barney were

1829
01:11:12,790 --> 01:11:09,840
as people

1830
01:11:13,669 --> 01:11:12,800
and the experience with the ufo the

1831
01:11:17,110 --> 01:11:13,679
abduction

1832
01:11:20,630 --> 01:11:17,120
and how it impacted their lives right

1833
01:11:23,189 --> 01:11:20,640
right and that that uh is

1834
01:11:24,149 --> 01:11:23,199
let me just see um that a question just

1835
01:11:26,550 --> 01:11:24,159
popped that is

1836
01:11:27,590 --> 01:11:26,560
one of the things that um you know i'd

1837
01:11:30,229 --> 01:11:27,600
like to talk about

1838
01:11:32,070 --> 01:11:30,239
more you know how they dealt with all

1839
01:11:34,470 --> 01:11:32,080
the pressure of this

1840
01:11:38,229 --> 01:11:34,480
you know how did they kind of filter

1841
01:11:41,669 --> 01:11:38,239
back into normal life or did they ever

1842
01:11:42,790 --> 01:11:41,679
i don't think they ever did after it was

1843
01:11:45,669 --> 01:11:42,800
made public

1844
01:11:47,350 --> 01:11:45,679
they filtered back into normal life

1845
01:11:50,070 --> 01:11:47,360
until it was made public

1846
01:11:51,750 --> 01:11:50,080
after the hypnosis sessions with dr

1847
01:11:54,310 --> 01:11:51,760
simon they worked through it

1848
01:11:56,390 --> 01:11:54,320
they tried to forget about it they

1849
01:11:58,790 --> 01:11:56,400
continued on with their civil rights

1850
01:12:00,630 --> 01:11:58,800
work and the things that they were

1851
01:12:03,550 --> 01:12:00,640
committed to doing

1852
01:12:05,669 --> 01:12:03,560
but it was that violation of

1853
01:12:10,070 --> 01:12:05,679
confidentiality that changed

1854
01:12:14,709 --> 01:12:10,080
everything and with that came

1855
01:12:17,430 --> 01:12:14,719
criticism came uh disinformants who

1856
01:12:18,470 --> 01:12:17,440
uh i believe at least a couple were

1857
01:12:21,030 --> 01:12:18,480
working

1858
01:12:21,750 --> 01:12:21,040
uh for the government i wrote about that

1859
01:12:25,830 --> 01:12:21,760
uh

1860
01:12:29,350 --> 01:12:25,840
in well one of my books

1861
01:12:31,669 --> 01:12:29,360
and and uh you know

1862
01:12:34,830 --> 01:12:31,679
they were closely associated with the

1863
01:12:37,910 --> 01:12:34,840
government and the cia and the nsa

1864
01:12:40,550 --> 01:12:37,920
so uh it

1865
01:12:41,669 --> 01:12:40,560
it really created problems i think in

1866
01:12:44,870 --> 01:12:41,679
their lives

1867
01:12:45,669 --> 01:12:44,880
uh barney had a massive cerebral

1868
01:12:50,310 --> 01:12:45,679
hemorrhage and

1869
01:12:53,830 --> 01:12:50,320
and died in february of 1969

1870
01:12:56,709 --> 01:12:53,840
i suspect that the

1871
01:12:57,830 --> 01:12:56,719
that it was related to the new pressures

1872
01:13:01,110 --> 01:12:57,840
that were put on

1873
01:13:03,030 --> 01:13:01,120
him and the he

1874
01:13:04,149 --> 01:13:03,040
he really cared about what people

1875
01:13:07,030 --> 01:13:04,159
thought about him

1876
01:13:08,709 --> 01:13:07,040
he had an excellent reputation but

1877
01:13:12,310 --> 01:13:08,719
suddenly he was being

1878
01:13:14,070 --> 01:13:12,320
portrayed as a weak man who would do or

1879
01:13:17,430 --> 01:13:14,080
say anything that his wife

1880
01:13:20,630 --> 01:13:17,440
told him to that was total baloney but

1881
01:13:24,310 --> 01:13:20,640
it was carried to the public he was

1882
01:13:27,030 --> 01:13:24,320
both he and betty were portrayed

1883
01:13:28,070 --> 01:13:27,040
publicly as being different than they

1884
01:13:30,950 --> 01:13:28,080
actually

1885
01:13:33,750 --> 01:13:30,960
were um valerie cunningham who was a

1886
01:13:40,630 --> 01:13:37,430
black portsmouth historian uh knew

1887
01:13:43,990 --> 01:13:40,640
barney uh her parents

1888
01:13:47,510 --> 01:13:44,000
knew barney as well and she said that

1889
01:13:50,870 --> 01:13:47,520
uh barney was strong and

1890
01:13:55,669 --> 01:13:50,880
courageous so i mean

1891
01:13:59,350 --> 01:13:55,679
that's from a woman who knew him well

1892
01:14:02,550 --> 01:13:59,360
wow now not how he was portrayed

1893
01:14:03,910 --> 01:14:02,560
i see okay i just want to um show this

1894
01:14:05,590 --> 01:14:03,920
right here first of all

1895
01:14:07,590 --> 01:14:05,600
this is kind of fun for people on

1896
01:14:11,030 --> 01:14:07,600
youtube um this was uh

1897
01:14:13,030 --> 01:14:11,040
the book uh captured that i got from

1898
01:14:14,310 --> 01:14:13,040
you uh kathleen and uh when you were

1899
01:14:16,070 --> 01:14:14,320
sitting next to

1900
01:14:17,430 --> 01:14:16,080
stan friedman and there's uh both of

1901
01:14:20,630 --> 01:14:17,440
your signatures there

1902
01:14:22,149 --> 01:14:20,640
and uh but i recently got this in the

1903
01:14:25,590 --> 01:14:22,159
mail this is your

1904
01:14:27,990 --> 01:14:25,600
latest edition right here the 660th

1905
01:14:30,070 --> 01:14:28,000
anniversary edition i noticed it's about

1906
01:14:33,189 --> 01:14:30,080
20 something it feels thicker

1907
01:14:35,030 --> 01:14:33,199
20 something pages more

1908
01:14:36,790 --> 01:14:35,040
than the other one and what can the

1909
01:14:39,750 --> 01:14:36,800
reader expect i have

1910
01:14:41,510 --> 01:14:39,760
read through a lot of this one you know

1911
01:14:43,189 --> 01:14:41,520
but i have not even started on this one

1912
01:14:45,590 --> 01:14:43,199
but is it basically the same with

1913
01:14:46,630 --> 01:14:45,600
some type of uh auditions here and there

1914
01:14:50,149 --> 01:14:46,640
what what i mean

1915
01:14:51,110 --> 01:14:50,159
i i made edits to the book in places

1916
01:14:54,709 --> 01:14:51,120
there are some

1917
01:14:57,910 --> 01:14:54,719
new photographs in the book and there is

1918
01:15:01,189 --> 01:14:57,920
a thick chapter on

1919
01:15:03,910 --> 01:15:01,199
all of the scientific research that has

1920
01:15:04,790 --> 01:15:03,920
been done since the first book was

1921
01:15:07,430 --> 01:15:04,800
published

1922
01:15:08,790 --> 01:15:07,440
so there's a tremendous amount of new

1923
01:15:10,709 --> 01:15:08,800
information

1924
01:15:12,870 --> 01:15:10,719
and when people read that i don't know

1925
01:15:16,390 --> 01:15:12,880
how they can possibly say

1926
01:15:18,390 --> 01:15:16,400
that this didn't happen and is that

1927
01:15:19,990 --> 01:15:18,400
is that throughout the book or is there

1928
01:15:24,070 --> 01:15:20,000
a separate new chapter

1929
01:15:27,669 --> 01:15:24,080
in there separate new chapter i see

1930
01:15:28,310 --> 01:15:27,679
yeah they had to do it that way because

1931
01:15:31,430 --> 01:15:28,320
of the

1932
01:15:32,390 --> 01:15:31,440
the printing or something i see can we

1933
01:15:35,669 --> 01:15:32,400
talk about

1934
01:15:39,270 --> 01:15:35,679
what some of that scientific research is

1935
01:15:39,669 --> 01:15:39,280
and has been done um i can't tell you

1936
01:15:44,229 --> 01:15:39,679
the

1937
01:15:48,630 --> 01:15:44,239
results but a new star map study

1938
01:15:52,310 --> 01:15:48,640
i see a study of alien symbols

1939
01:15:55,590 --> 01:15:52,320
dna analysis on the dress

1940
01:15:59,590 --> 01:15:55,600
uh new uh chemical analysis

1941
01:16:01,350 --> 01:15:59,600
on the dress um witnesses to the craft

1942
01:16:04,630 --> 01:16:01,360
that night i did mention that

1943
01:16:08,149 --> 01:16:04,640
in our discussion already um

1944
01:16:13,990 --> 01:16:11,510
yeah yeah um you you did address

1945
01:16:14,550 --> 01:16:14,000
um when when betty saw the second craft

1946
01:16:16,310 --> 01:16:14,560
right

1947
01:16:18,229 --> 01:16:16,320
i mean i thought i put that question up

1948
01:16:20,470 --> 01:16:18,239
there no i i

1949
01:16:21,750 --> 01:16:20,480
i forgot that one oh that part of it oh

1950
01:16:25,110 --> 01:16:21,760
you didn't you didn't say

1951
01:16:27,910 --> 01:16:25,120
okay i see okay so what

1952
01:16:28,709 --> 01:16:27,920
yeah and what was that what was that i i

1953
01:16:31,990 --> 01:16:28,719
don't remember

1954
01:16:34,950 --> 01:16:32,000
hearing anything about that yeah um well

1955
01:16:35,990 --> 01:16:34,960
there were two incidents where she might

1956
01:16:38,790 --> 01:16:36,000
have seen

1957
01:16:40,070 --> 01:16:38,800
the entities on the craft one was after

1958
01:16:41,910 --> 01:16:40,080
barney's death

1959
01:16:43,910 --> 01:16:41,920
when she was returning home at night

1960
01:16:47,910 --> 01:16:43,920
from my grandparents house

1961
01:16:48,310 --> 01:16:47,920
and she saw a craft up very close it was

1962
01:16:50,950 --> 01:16:48,320
at

1963
01:16:52,390 --> 01:16:50,960
uh high just about the height of the

1964
01:16:55,750 --> 01:16:52,400
telephone poles

1965
01:16:58,630 --> 01:16:55,760
uh another time was when she

1966
01:16:59,750 --> 01:16:58,640
was out taking photographs of these

1967
01:17:04,229 --> 01:16:59,760
craft after she

1968
01:17:07,990 --> 01:17:04,239
with the ce5 experiments she was doing

1969
01:17:09,910 --> 01:17:08,000
there she took a great photo of a craft

1970
01:17:12,149 --> 01:17:09,920
with what appeared to be an entity

1971
01:17:15,590 --> 01:17:12,159
standing in the window

1972
01:17:17,990 --> 01:17:15,600
and did you say a photograph yes is that

1973
01:17:19,910 --> 01:17:18,000
anywhere can we see that anywhere it's

1974
01:17:21,270 --> 01:17:19,920
right in the book unfortunately it's in

1975
01:17:23,430 --> 01:17:21,280
black and white

1976
01:17:25,270 --> 01:17:23,440
and it doesn't show up the way it did on

1977
01:17:28,630 --> 01:17:25,280
the slides

1978
01:17:30,950 --> 01:17:28,640
um but it's in the book

1979
01:17:32,149 --> 01:17:30,960
is that online also anywhere anybody can

1980
01:17:36,229 --> 01:17:32,159
find it

1981
01:17:39,590 --> 01:17:36,239
you know i don't think so

1982
01:17:41,590 --> 01:17:39,600
i show it when i do uh lectures

1983
01:17:42,870 --> 01:17:41,600
on it and i will be doing some lectures

1984
01:17:46,709 --> 01:17:42,880
this year

1985
01:17:48,870 --> 01:17:46,719
at roswell and um other places

1986
01:17:49,990 --> 01:17:48,880
so you're actually going to roswell's

1987
01:17:51,910 --> 01:17:50,000
going to be

1988
01:17:53,669 --> 01:17:51,920
open to the public basically this year

1989
01:17:57,430 --> 01:17:53,679
it is they're going to have their ufo

1990
01:18:02,149 --> 01:17:57,440
festival and i've had hallelujah

1991
01:18:04,709 --> 01:18:02,159
so somewhat normalcy yes and possibly

1992
01:18:05,590 --> 01:18:04,719
exeter new hampshire is planning to have

1993
01:18:07,750 --> 01:18:05,600
it

1994
01:18:08,709 --> 01:18:07,760
i have there as well that's always in

1995
01:18:11,990 --> 01:18:08,719
the fall

1996
01:18:14,470 --> 01:18:12,000
usually over labor day weekend yeah

1997
01:18:16,229 --> 01:18:14,480
and i'm sure i'll see you there yeah as

1998
01:18:18,229 --> 01:18:16,239
long as i can get all the approvals and

1999
01:18:19,350 --> 01:18:18,239
i'm going to be talking about the 60th

2000
01:18:22,470 --> 01:18:19,360
anniversary

2001
01:18:25,669 --> 01:18:22,480
of betty and barney's uh encounter

2002
01:18:27,590 --> 01:18:25,679
perfect timing then yeah um we're going

2003
01:18:29,430 --> 01:18:27,600
to be taking calls in about 15 minutes

2004
01:18:30,310 --> 01:18:29,440
just to let everyone know so if you have

2005
01:18:32,950 --> 01:18:30,320
questions

2006
01:18:34,550 --> 01:18:32,960
um you can also uh i do see a lot of

2007
01:18:36,229 --> 01:18:34,560
people have been posting them

2008
01:18:38,070 --> 01:18:36,239
and thank you for that please put them

2009
01:18:42,310 --> 01:18:38,080
in caps when you put them up on

2010
01:18:45,750 --> 01:18:42,320
the chat either facebook or youtube um

2011
01:18:47,830 --> 01:18:45,760
so when you were um when you were

2012
01:18:49,030 --> 01:18:47,840
growing up and going you know through

2013
01:18:51,830 --> 01:18:49,040
your everyday life

2014
01:18:53,350 --> 01:18:51,840
did people know that you were related to

2015
01:18:57,430 --> 01:18:53,360
betty did that ever come up

2016
01:19:00,470 --> 01:18:57,440
at any point no because i uh in 1966

2017
01:19:03,590 --> 01:19:00,480
well 19 let's go to 1965

2018
01:19:06,709 --> 01:19:03,600
i was a junior you know i was a senior

2019
01:19:10,310 --> 01:19:06,719
in high school i graduated in 1966.

2020
01:19:13,510 --> 01:19:10,320
so they found out in 1965

2021
01:19:15,590 --> 01:19:13,520
but i was uh on the student council an

2022
01:19:17,830 --> 01:19:15,600
officer on the student council and

2023
01:19:20,229 --> 01:19:17,840
i was highly respected in school nobody

2024
01:19:23,590 --> 01:19:20,239
would dare to give me a hard time

2025
01:19:26,950 --> 01:19:23,600
about it that's good

2026
01:19:29,990 --> 01:19:26,960
so yeah they the kids knew at school

2027
01:19:33,350 --> 01:19:30,000
knew about that and i i told people that

2028
01:19:36,149 --> 01:19:33,360
betty hill was my my aunt

2029
01:19:37,350 --> 01:19:36,159
and um but when i was working

2030
01:19:40,310 --> 01:19:37,360
professionally

2031
01:19:40,709 --> 01:19:40,320
i didn't i didn't talk about it because

2032
01:19:44,390 --> 01:19:40,719
i

2033
01:19:47,350 --> 01:19:44,400
my career

2034
01:19:48,470 --> 01:19:47,360
right and you and i i mean i i i was in

2035
01:19:51,350 --> 01:19:48,480
portsmouth a lot of

2036
01:19:52,870 --> 01:19:51,360
a big part of my life and uh did weren't

2037
01:19:54,149 --> 01:19:52,880
you in like newington or something like

2038
01:19:56,229 --> 01:19:54,159
that or am i getting that wrong

2039
01:19:58,229 --> 01:19:56,239
i didn't stratum stratum that's right

2040
01:20:01,910 --> 01:19:58,239
okay um

2041
01:20:03,189 --> 01:20:01,920
and so when the movie i forget what it

2042
01:20:05,189 --> 01:20:03,199
was called

2043
01:20:07,430 --> 01:20:05,199
um came out about betty and barney it

2044
01:20:07,750 --> 01:20:07,440
was just it was i remember that because

2045
01:20:11,750 --> 01:20:07,760
i

2046
01:20:15,830 --> 01:20:11,760
year was that

2047
01:20:18,149 --> 01:20:15,840
uh 1975 i believe it was called the ufo

2048
01:20:19,030 --> 01:20:18,159
incident starring james earl jones

2049
01:20:22,709 --> 01:20:19,040
that's right

2050
01:20:24,470 --> 01:20:22,719
parsons yeah and uh james earl jones

2051
01:20:25,750 --> 01:20:24,480
did a great job in that if i remember

2052
01:20:29,590 --> 01:20:25,760
right he did

2053
01:20:30,550 --> 01:20:29,600
did an excellent job in that yeah he's a

2054
01:20:31,830 --> 01:20:30,560
fine actor

2055
01:20:34,550 --> 01:20:31,840
and what did you think about the

2056
01:20:36,790 --> 01:20:34,560
portrayal of betty

2057
01:20:38,950 --> 01:20:36,800
it wasn't accurate i remembered that i

2058
01:20:41,350 --> 01:20:38,960
remember you said something like that

2059
01:20:42,470 --> 01:20:41,360
it wasn't accurate um you know estelle

2060
01:20:46,070 --> 01:20:42,480
parsons

2061
01:20:49,510 --> 01:20:46,080
portrayed kind of a little 60s woman

2062
01:20:53,110 --> 01:20:49,520
who uh had poor self-esteem

2063
01:20:55,910 --> 01:20:53,120
and um just kind of silly i thought

2064
01:20:56,550 --> 01:20:55,920
and that's that's not the way betty was

2065
01:21:00,470 --> 01:20:56,560
i thought

2066
01:21:03,590 --> 01:21:00,480
betty davis would have done

2067
01:21:04,229 --> 01:21:03,600
more like betty perfect yeah um that

2068
01:21:07,030 --> 01:21:04,239
would have been

2069
01:21:09,270 --> 01:21:07,040
perfect back then in 1975 too if i

2070
01:21:11,669 --> 01:21:09,280
remember right um

2071
01:21:13,430 --> 01:21:11,679
yeah but i do remember watching that and

2072
01:21:15,350 --> 01:21:13,440
that was like nothing else i'd ever seen

2073
01:21:18,550 --> 01:21:15,360
before and then i remember

2074
01:21:19,910 --> 01:21:18,560
um like going into work the next day

2075
01:21:21,830 --> 01:21:19,920
someone else had seen it and they said

2076
01:21:23,270 --> 01:21:21,840
that's a true story i said no that's

2077
01:21:25,189 --> 01:21:23,280
that can't be a true story they said

2078
01:21:27,110 --> 01:21:25,199
yeah it happened right here and

2079
01:21:29,750 --> 01:21:27,120
and they knew all about it i remember

2080
01:21:31,510 --> 01:21:29,760
that yeah it wasn't entirely accurate

2081
01:21:32,870 --> 01:21:31,520
but the interrupted journey wasn't

2082
01:21:36,629 --> 01:21:32,880
entirely accurate

2083
01:21:38,229 --> 01:21:36,639
either um john fuller's publisher put a

2084
01:21:41,510 --> 01:21:38,239
lot of pressure on him

2085
01:21:43,590 --> 01:21:41,520
to make the story more interesting and

2086
01:21:44,229 --> 01:21:43,600
put tension into it and that sort of

2087
01:21:47,590 --> 01:21:44,239
thing

2088
01:21:49,430 --> 01:21:47,600
that wasn't there in the true story

2089
01:21:52,470 --> 01:21:49,440
which is what stanton and i

2090
01:21:55,990 --> 01:21:52,480
wrote um so they're so

2091
01:21:57,350 --> 01:21:56,000
a little bit different but john the

2092
01:21:59,350 --> 01:21:57,360
publisher i went to

2093
01:22:02,310 --> 01:21:59,360
stanton and i went to john fuller's

2094
01:22:05,910 --> 01:22:02,320
archival collection at boston university

2095
01:22:08,229 --> 01:22:05,920
and uh there were letters there saying

2096
01:22:10,470 --> 01:22:08,239
you know you're going to have to do this

2097
01:22:14,629 --> 01:22:10,480
if you want to have a book

2098
01:22:17,590 --> 01:22:14,639
hmm wow well so a question

2099
01:22:18,790 --> 01:22:17,600
over from facebook do you feel that now

2100
01:22:20,629 --> 01:22:18,800
this is something you're actually

2101
01:22:22,950 --> 01:22:20,639
involved in so you would have an answer

2102
01:22:26,070 --> 01:22:22,960
to it do you feel abductions are on the

2103
01:22:32,149 --> 01:22:29,110
i think reports are on the rise because

2104
01:22:35,990 --> 01:22:32,159
people who have had these experiences

2105
01:22:39,110 --> 01:22:36,000
over a lifetime feel more comfortable

2106
01:22:39,910 --> 01:22:39,120
speaking about it now not necessarily on

2107
01:22:43,430 --> 01:22:39,920
the air

2108
01:22:46,229 --> 01:22:43,440
but to other people i was for

2109
01:22:46,950 --> 01:22:46,239
10 years the mutual ufo networks

2110
01:22:49,510 --> 01:22:46,960
director of

2111
01:22:50,709 --> 01:22:49,520
experiencer research i stepped down

2112
01:22:53,910 --> 01:22:50,719
recently

2113
01:22:55,510 --> 01:22:53,920
due to time constraints but uh during

2114
01:22:58,870 --> 01:22:55,520
that time

2115
01:23:02,790 --> 01:22:58,880
um i would say we

2116
01:23:07,030 --> 01:23:02,800
received about 100 reports each month

2117
01:23:10,550 --> 01:23:07,040
and we're more of a support kind of uh

2118
01:23:12,470 --> 01:23:10,560
arm of mufon all of the the people are

2119
01:23:16,390 --> 01:23:12,480
also ufo investigators

2120
01:23:18,390 --> 01:23:16,400
but uh they do non-judgmental

2121
01:23:20,310 --> 01:23:18,400
listening they're supportive they will

2122
01:23:24,629 --> 01:23:20,320
not criticize

2123
01:23:27,350 --> 01:23:24,639
they have a list of approved vetted

2124
01:23:28,629 --> 01:23:27,360
hypnosis practitioners mental health

2125
01:23:31,669 --> 01:23:28,639
providers if

2126
01:23:35,030 --> 01:23:31,679
people are traumatized and

2127
01:23:37,669 --> 01:23:35,040
support groups for referrals we

2128
01:23:38,310 --> 01:23:37,679
well we don't exactly make referrals we

2129
01:23:41,189 --> 01:23:38,320
have that

2130
01:23:42,870 --> 01:23:41,199
list and people can have their names

2131
01:23:44,870 --> 01:23:42,880
they enter into a private for

2132
01:23:45,990 --> 01:23:44,880
pay relationship with these

2133
01:23:49,350 --> 01:23:46,000
professionals the

2134
01:23:54,070 --> 01:23:49,360
mufon does not give free services but

2135
01:23:57,830 --> 01:23:56,950
that's really a good service and i know

2136
01:24:03,270 --> 01:23:57,840
that

2137
01:24:04,390 --> 01:24:03,280
you know it really helps people to talk

2138
01:24:06,870 --> 01:24:04,400
about it

2139
01:24:08,870 --> 01:24:06,880
it really does yes i mean i've seen

2140
01:24:10,790 --> 01:24:08,880
people at these conferences that

2141
01:24:11,910 --> 01:24:10,800
you know leave the rooms after talking

2142
01:24:14,550 --> 01:24:11,920
about it and it's

2143
01:24:16,550 --> 01:24:14,560
in a way like a group therapy type of

2144
01:24:19,590 --> 01:24:16,560
situation where they can all

2145
01:24:20,629 --> 01:24:19,600
discuss it freely um you and denise

2146
01:24:22,550 --> 01:24:20,639
stoner did

2147
01:24:24,149 --> 01:24:22,560
uh pooh she was on the show at one time

2148
01:24:27,669 --> 01:24:24,159
i believe with you actually

2149
01:24:30,229 --> 01:24:27,679
um you did a commonalities

2150
01:24:30,870 --> 01:24:30,239
study didn't you i remembered something

2151
01:24:33,830 --> 01:24:30,880
about that

2152
01:24:34,870 --> 01:24:33,840
yes we did one together and then i've

2153
01:24:37,030 --> 01:24:34,880
worked on

2154
01:24:39,430 --> 01:24:37,040
two after that one for the edgar

2155
01:24:42,709 --> 01:24:39,440
mitchell free foundation and yes

2156
01:24:44,870 --> 01:24:42,719
that was uh 3200 cases

2157
01:24:47,750 --> 01:24:44,880
at the time the book was published and

2158
01:24:50,390 --> 01:24:47,760
then i did another one with dr don c

2159
01:24:52,870 --> 01:24:50,400
donderi and dr michael austin melton

2160
01:24:54,470 --> 01:24:52,880
denise was part of this and others on

2161
01:24:58,950 --> 01:24:54,480
the ert

2162
01:25:01,669 --> 01:24:58,960
uh who we did one on 516

2163
01:25:02,629 --> 01:25:01,679
experiencers so we have a tremendous

2164
01:25:05,430 --> 01:25:02,639
amount

2165
01:25:07,669 --> 01:25:05,440
of uh statistical information on

2166
01:25:10,870 --> 01:25:07,679
commonalities that experiencers

2167
01:25:13,669 --> 01:25:10,880
share that are not common in the general

2168
01:25:16,709 --> 01:25:13,679
population

2169
01:25:19,189 --> 01:25:16,719
i see wow um

2170
01:25:20,790 --> 01:25:19,199
let's see i want to pop up another uh

2171
01:25:23,990 --> 01:25:20,800
question

2172
01:25:26,950 --> 01:25:24,000
and uh on wait before i do that though

2173
01:25:28,550 --> 01:25:26,960
in the commonalities what would you say

2174
01:25:32,229 --> 01:25:28,560
is the most

2175
01:25:34,629 --> 01:25:32,239
um apparent common

2176
01:25:36,390 --> 01:25:34,639
um thing that happens during what people

2177
01:25:40,070 --> 01:25:36,400
are reporting

2178
01:25:43,030 --> 01:25:40,080
well it's there are changes that

2179
01:25:44,709 --> 01:25:43,040
that experiencers undergo they become

2180
01:25:48,149 --> 01:25:44,719
different people

2181
01:25:51,590 --> 01:25:48,159
and uh experiencers are uh

2182
01:25:54,149 --> 01:25:51,600
a more altruistic they have a different

2183
01:25:54,870 --> 01:25:54,159
uh perception of the world than other

2184
01:25:57,669 --> 01:25:54,880
people

2185
01:25:58,629 --> 01:25:57,679
they are more highly spiritual they

2186
01:26:02,229 --> 01:25:58,639
become psychic

2187
01:26:03,350 --> 01:26:02,239
or intuitive they become empaths where

2188
01:26:06,709 --> 01:26:03,360
they can

2189
01:26:08,870 --> 01:26:06,719
sense the physical body

2190
01:26:10,390 --> 01:26:08,880
the emotions of another person as if

2191
01:26:13,270 --> 01:26:10,400
they were their own

2192
01:26:13,990 --> 01:26:13,280
if the et's are doing that intentionally

2193
01:26:16,709 --> 01:26:14,000
then

2194
01:26:18,390 --> 01:26:16,719
uh they're brilliant because you can't

2195
01:26:22,310 --> 01:26:18,400
harm another person

2196
01:26:24,470 --> 01:26:22,320
if you feel their pain so those are

2197
01:26:25,590 --> 01:26:24,480
those are things that really stood out

2198
01:26:27,390 --> 01:26:25,600
to me uh

2199
01:26:28,709 --> 01:26:27,400
it tends to be generational

2200
01:26:32,229 --> 01:26:28,719
intergenerational

2201
01:26:36,470 --> 01:26:32,239
in about 60 of the experiencers

2202
01:26:37,669 --> 01:26:36,480
knew of family members who had also been

2203
01:26:39,669 --> 01:26:37,679
taken

2204
01:26:41,990 --> 01:26:39,679
and the same percentage of family

2205
01:26:45,030 --> 01:26:42,000
members who had had close encounters

2206
01:26:48,870 --> 01:26:45,040
with craft i remember

2207
01:26:49,189 --> 01:26:48,880
i was at a conference when you announced

2208
01:26:52,390 --> 01:26:49,199
that

2209
01:26:55,430 --> 01:26:52,400
speaking about your own

2210
01:26:58,629 --> 01:26:55,440
situation and is that still

2211
01:27:01,830 --> 01:26:58,639
comfortable for you to talk about i

2212
01:27:04,390 --> 01:27:01,840
i can mention it it's just that i'm a

2213
01:27:05,590 --> 01:27:04,400
generational experiencer my mother and i

2214
01:27:08,070 --> 01:27:05,600
were taken

2215
01:27:10,310 --> 01:27:08,080
when craft landed on my grandparents

2216
01:27:12,629 --> 01:27:10,320
farm in 1966

2217
01:27:14,390 --> 01:27:12,639
we'd had a close encounter a couple of

2218
01:27:17,750 --> 01:27:14,400
months before that

2219
01:27:19,750 --> 01:27:17,760
and in april of 66

2220
01:27:21,990 --> 01:27:19,760
the craft landed 200 feet from my

2221
01:27:23,990 --> 01:27:22,000
childhood home on my grandparents farm

2222
01:27:25,350 --> 01:27:24,000
my mother and i both remembered being

2223
01:27:27,669 --> 01:27:25,360
taken it was

2224
01:27:30,310 --> 01:27:27,679
to remain confidential for the remainder

2225
01:27:32,709 --> 01:27:30,320
of my life

2226
01:27:34,310 --> 01:27:32,719
dr james harder investigated it he

2227
01:27:37,030 --> 01:27:34,320
hypnotized us

2228
01:27:37,590 --> 01:27:37,040
uh it was ongoing periodically for my

2229
01:27:41,750 --> 01:27:37,600
mother

2230
01:27:44,950 --> 01:27:41,760
and myself uh not necessarily together

2231
01:27:48,310 --> 01:27:44,960
and uh over the years

2232
01:27:49,270 --> 01:27:48,320
but uh do you feel like pardon me go

2233
01:27:52,950 --> 01:27:49,280
ahead

2234
01:27:56,229 --> 01:27:52,960
i'm going to say that initially i was

2235
01:27:57,110 --> 01:27:56,239
terrified i was traumatized but i worked

2236
01:28:00,470 --> 01:27:57,120
through that

2237
01:28:03,990 --> 01:28:00,480
and and realized that

2238
01:28:07,669 --> 01:28:04,000
the hypno memories i had under hypnosis

2239
01:28:09,750 --> 01:28:07,679
were of kind entities um

2240
01:28:11,270 --> 01:28:09,760
they they were really caring and they

2241
01:28:15,910 --> 01:28:11,280
didn't harm me

2242
01:28:22,629 --> 01:28:19,590
i feel that they are here because

2243
01:28:23,990 --> 01:28:22,639
they have concerns about humanity and

2244
01:28:27,189 --> 01:28:24,000
something they've told me

2245
01:28:27,990 --> 01:28:27,199
and many many other people is that our

2246
01:28:31,590 --> 01:28:28,000
spiritual

2247
01:28:35,350 --> 01:28:31,600
development is out of sync with our

2248
01:28:38,149 --> 01:28:35,360
uh technological growth

2249
01:28:39,990 --> 01:28:38,159
and and development and when these two

2250
01:28:43,350 --> 01:28:40,000
things are out of sync there's a

2251
01:28:46,070 --> 01:28:43,360
danger that uh the earth we could

2252
01:28:47,110 --> 01:28:46,080
destroy our planet uh they say that

2253
01:28:50,070 --> 01:28:47,120
they've seen it happen

2254
01:28:52,229 --> 01:28:50,080
elsewhere and that is their major

2255
01:28:54,390 --> 01:28:52,239
concern that's why they came back in the

2256
01:28:57,270 --> 01:28:54,400
1940s and stayed

2257
01:28:58,629 --> 01:28:57,280
uh otherwise be in the centuries before

2258
01:29:02,310 --> 01:28:58,639
that according to

2259
01:29:05,830 --> 01:29:02,320
major general john uh samford

2260
01:29:07,350 --> 01:29:05,840
a statement he made in july of 1952

2261
01:29:09,669 --> 01:29:07,360
uh these things have been seen in the

2262
01:29:12,390 --> 01:29:09,679
sky since biblical times

2263
01:29:14,149 --> 01:29:12,400
they come back every century they're

2264
01:29:17,270 --> 01:29:14,159
observed every century

2265
01:29:20,229 --> 01:29:17,280
but and then they leave during the 20th

2266
01:29:22,550 --> 01:29:20,239
century they came back and stayed

2267
01:29:24,790 --> 01:29:22,560
wow well i'll tell you if that's what

2268
01:29:27,830 --> 01:29:24,800
they were saying um

2269
01:29:29,830 --> 01:29:27,840
no one could say it better i don't think

2270
01:29:31,669 --> 01:29:29,840
uh i think we are totally out of sync

2271
01:29:33,110 --> 01:29:31,679
and that we could destroy ourselves very

2272
01:29:34,950 --> 01:29:33,120
easily and

2273
01:29:36,229 --> 01:29:34,960
and uh that bottleneck we have to get

2274
01:29:39,430 --> 01:29:36,239
through so to speak

2275
01:29:41,910 --> 01:29:39,440
yeah yeah um i am going to

2276
01:29:43,350 --> 01:29:41,920
uh this is all good we do have uh before

2277
01:30:16,390 --> 01:29:43,360
i

2278
01:30:18,229 --> 01:30:16,400
and don't forget next week we have just

2279
01:30:20,070 --> 01:30:18,239
a call-in show and that number is eight

2280
01:30:22,950 --> 01:30:20,080
five five four seven two five

2281
01:30:24,629 --> 01:30:22,960
four eight three if you're listening and

2282
01:30:26,550 --> 01:30:24,639
uh you're not on youtube again that

2283
01:30:28,149 --> 01:30:26,560
number is eight five five four seven two

2284
01:30:31,910 --> 01:30:28,159
five four eight three

2285
01:30:32,310 --> 01:30:31,920
and bill is standing by good bill over

2286
01:30:33,910 --> 01:30:32,320
there

2287
01:30:38,310 --> 01:30:33,920
he's uh going to be helping me out next

2288
01:30:42,470 --> 01:30:40,470
well i'm having a great time i'm so glad

2289
01:30:44,790 --> 01:30:42,480
you could come on this show and i know

2290
01:30:46,550 --> 01:30:44,800
um i saw that you were doing a lot of

2291
01:30:49,590 --> 01:30:46,560
interviews so a lot of people are

2292
01:30:53,110 --> 01:30:49,600
interviewing about about this

2293
01:30:53,669 --> 01:30:53,120
yeah um here's another question i think

2294
01:30:56,950 --> 01:30:53,679
it's pretty

2295
01:30:59,750 --> 01:30:56,960
uh pretty interesting and mary grace

2296
01:31:01,669 --> 01:30:59,760
asks did betty or barney or you or your

2297
01:31:02,390 --> 01:31:01,679
mother acquire any psychic abilities

2298
01:31:05,430 --> 01:31:02,400
after

2299
01:31:06,229 --> 01:31:05,440
abductions anything change i know that

2300
01:31:09,669 --> 01:31:06,239
betty was

2301
01:31:12,070 --> 01:31:09,679
uh always kind of intuitive she said

2302
01:31:12,870 --> 01:31:12,080
she'd always say she wasn't psychic but

2303
01:31:15,990 --> 01:31:12,880
she was

2304
01:31:19,590 --> 01:31:16,000
intuitive i don't know about

2305
01:31:21,750 --> 01:31:19,600
my mother but uh for me i'm highly

2306
01:31:25,030 --> 01:31:21,760
intuitive

2307
01:31:27,669 --> 01:31:25,040
i've taken people in experiments where

2308
01:31:28,629 --> 01:31:27,679
uh i was hitting the target pretty well

2309
01:31:30,790 --> 01:31:28,639
really wow

2310
01:31:32,550 --> 01:31:30,800
that's interesting now did you ever

2311
01:31:33,669 --> 01:31:32,560
consider that there was possibly a

2312
01:31:36,229 --> 01:31:33,679
connection between

2313
01:31:37,110 --> 01:31:36,239
what betty and barney was involved with

2314
01:31:40,310 --> 01:31:37,120
in your own

2315
01:31:41,830 --> 01:31:40,320
situation oh absolutely really wow what

2316
01:31:44,229 --> 01:31:41,840
happened to my mother and i

2317
01:31:45,669 --> 01:31:44,239
occurred when betty was working with a

2318
01:31:48,870 --> 01:31:45,679
team of scientists

2319
01:31:52,070 --> 01:31:48,880
who were trying to call in

2320
01:31:54,149 --> 01:31:52,080
craft and she

2321
01:31:55,430 --> 01:31:54,159
wanted one to land on my grandparents

2322
01:31:57,430 --> 01:31:55,440
farm

2323
01:31:58,629 --> 01:31:57,440
and so i think that you know they

2324
01:32:00,950 --> 01:31:58,639
probably

2325
01:32:03,110 --> 01:32:00,960
thought that maybe betty wanted them to

2326
01:32:06,390 --> 01:32:03,120
meet the family

2327
01:32:08,390 --> 01:32:06,400
my goodness wow i'm i think there's a

2328
01:32:09,990 --> 01:32:08,400
an amazing question up here that i've

2329
01:32:12,550 --> 01:32:10,000
never even considered

2330
01:32:14,149 --> 01:32:12,560
myself in any type of way not that i

2331
01:32:17,430 --> 01:32:14,159
look a lot into the

2332
01:32:20,950 --> 01:32:17,440
abductions or experiencers part of this

2333
01:32:25,189 --> 01:32:20,960
but uh david writes are people in prison

2334
01:32:28,310 --> 01:32:25,199
ever abducted wow what a thought

2335
01:32:29,189 --> 01:32:28,320
i don't know of any abductees who are in

2336
01:32:33,750 --> 01:32:29,199
prison

2337
01:32:36,790 --> 01:32:33,760
so they want to be abducted

2338
01:32:38,390 --> 01:32:36,800
they would love to be abducted yeah yeah

2339
01:32:39,990 --> 01:32:38,400
well that's a that's a really great

2340
01:32:42,950 --> 01:32:40,000
question and i'd love to

2341
01:32:43,910 --> 01:32:42,960
find out if there's ever any um ever any

2342
01:32:46,790 --> 01:32:43,920
answers to that

2343
01:32:48,229 --> 01:32:46,800
if you well you know if uh if

2344
01:32:50,950 --> 01:32:48,239
experiencers become

2345
01:32:51,910 --> 01:32:50,960
empathic then they probably wouldn't go

2346
01:32:54,070 --> 01:32:51,920
to prison

2347
01:32:57,270 --> 01:32:54,080
because if they harm somebody else they

2348
01:33:02,870 --> 01:33:00,629
oh wow all right uh we have rob

2349
01:33:05,830 --> 01:33:02,880
um on the line calling from pennsylvania

2350
01:33:08,149 --> 01:33:05,840
rob welcome to the show

2351
01:33:09,990 --> 01:33:08,159
thank you and uh thanks for your show

2352
01:33:11,510 --> 01:33:10,000
and thanks kathleen for being on the

2353
01:33:15,430 --> 01:33:11,520
show

2354
01:33:17,430 --> 01:33:15,440
i just had a i had a question about um

2355
01:33:18,870 --> 01:33:17,440
maybe your insight into what

2356
01:33:21,830 --> 01:33:18,880
experiencers

2357
01:33:22,310 --> 01:33:21,840
remember and the things that they see

2358
01:33:25,590 --> 01:33:22,320
when they

2359
01:33:27,030 --> 01:33:25,600
have the events happen to them

2360
01:33:30,470 --> 01:33:27,040
i know that there are various things

2361
01:33:34,229 --> 01:33:30,480
like lost time

2362
01:33:37,510 --> 01:33:34,239
and memories that come and go is there

2363
01:33:40,709 --> 01:33:37,520
possibly an explanation you might uh

2364
01:33:43,830 --> 01:33:40,719
have for that kind of uh

2365
01:33:45,110 --> 01:33:43,840
mind uh like mindset or something i'm

2366
01:33:47,110 --> 01:33:45,120
not gonna describe it

2367
01:33:50,149 --> 01:33:47,120
or is there some kind of like hypnosis

2368
01:33:53,350 --> 01:33:50,159
state they may be experiencing

2369
01:33:55,590 --> 01:33:53,360
while they're being abducted

2370
01:33:57,030 --> 01:33:55,600
and then they they their their memories

2371
01:34:00,149 --> 01:33:57,040
of what happened or their attempts of

2372
01:34:04,229 --> 01:34:00,159
communication that may occur

2373
01:34:07,910 --> 01:34:04,239
to them they may visualize things

2374
01:34:09,510 --> 01:34:07,920
in an unusual way almost like a dream um

2375
01:34:11,350 --> 01:34:09,520
yeah so i'm having trouble trying to

2376
01:34:14,470 --> 01:34:11,360
explain what i'm trying to

2377
01:34:17,910 --> 01:34:14,480
do so i'll try to

2378
01:34:19,669 --> 01:34:17,920
answer that in our studies we discovered

2379
01:34:22,470 --> 01:34:19,679
that the majority

2380
01:34:23,430 --> 01:34:22,480
of experiencers have some conscious

2381
01:34:26,470 --> 01:34:23,440
recall

2382
01:34:29,590 --> 01:34:26,480
of what has occurred especially uh

2383
01:34:32,149 --> 01:34:29,600
when they're being taken and

2384
01:34:33,270 --> 01:34:32,159
they're oftentimes they're awake and

2385
01:34:35,990 --> 01:34:33,280
they say that it's

2386
01:34:38,229 --> 01:34:36,000
it's like uh undergoing anesthesia and

2387
01:34:41,750 --> 01:34:38,239
then coming out of anesthesia

2388
01:34:43,109 --> 01:34:41,760
in terms of memories there might be two

2389
01:34:45,750 --> 01:34:43,119
things at play

2390
01:34:46,709 --> 01:34:45,760
uh i don't think that it's the trauma of

2391
01:34:49,910 --> 01:34:46,719
the event that

2392
01:34:52,149 --> 01:34:49,920
wipes out the memory i i believe that

2393
01:34:55,990 --> 01:34:52,159
these non-human entities

2394
01:34:58,870 --> 01:34:56,000
uh either do it intentionally

2395
01:35:00,470 --> 01:34:58,880
because when betty was being walked off

2396
01:35:02,950 --> 01:35:00,480
the craft

2397
01:35:03,990 --> 01:35:02,960
she said to the leader do you think you

2398
01:35:06,310 --> 01:35:04,000
can come back

2399
01:35:07,510 --> 01:35:06,320
sometime there are people i'd like for

2400
01:35:13,030 --> 01:35:07,520
you to

2401
01:35:15,350 --> 01:35:13,040
to meet and he said well he didn't know

2402
01:35:17,189 --> 01:35:15,360
but perhaps he would he it wasn't his

2403
01:35:20,310 --> 01:35:17,199
decision to make and she said

2404
01:35:23,030 --> 01:35:20,320
well how would you find me

2405
01:35:24,629 --> 01:35:23,040
and he said we can always find those

2406
01:35:28,310 --> 01:35:24,639
that we want to

2407
01:35:30,629 --> 01:35:28,320
find and he told her that well we've

2408
01:35:34,470 --> 01:35:30,639
decided that you and barney shouldn't

2409
01:35:36,550 --> 01:35:34,480
remember this that uh we've decided that

2410
01:35:39,910 --> 01:35:36,560
you're going to forget about it

2411
01:35:42,229 --> 01:35:39,920
and betty said uh then you know if

2412
01:35:44,390 --> 01:35:42,239
if it's the last thing i ever do i'm

2413
01:35:47,510 --> 01:35:44,400
going to remember this

2414
01:35:49,990 --> 01:35:47,520
and uh she did remember more

2415
01:35:50,790 --> 01:35:50,000
than barney and she worked through some

2416
01:35:54,149 --> 01:35:50,800
of this

2417
01:35:57,270 --> 01:35:54,159
in the dreams that she had but

2418
01:36:00,310 --> 01:35:57,280
um that might be the

2419
01:36:01,910 --> 01:36:00,320
their decision i also took part nix in

2420
01:36:05,590 --> 01:36:01,920
an experiment

2421
01:36:09,510 --> 01:36:05,600
and in this experiment we had

2422
01:36:11,350 --> 01:36:09,520
uh as people who were ufo

2423
01:36:12,550 --> 01:36:11,360
abduction researchers we had a

2424
01:36:16,149 --> 01:36:12,560
psychotherapist

2425
01:36:20,390 --> 01:36:16,159
two skeptics and a man

2426
01:36:21,669 --> 01:36:20,400
uh who communicates with non-humans he's

2427
01:36:23,750 --> 01:36:21,679
been

2428
01:36:24,870 --> 01:36:23,760
in communication since he was eight

2429
01:36:27,590 --> 01:36:24,880
years old when

2430
01:36:28,790 --> 01:36:27,600
they appeared in front of him and he was

2431
01:36:30,709 --> 01:36:28,800
a police officer

2432
01:36:32,870 --> 01:36:30,719
from england he now lives in the united

2433
01:36:33,830 --> 01:36:32,880
states in the same town that i live in

2434
01:36:37,590 --> 01:36:33,840
so this was

2435
01:36:40,950 --> 01:36:37,600
very convenient when we met and

2436
01:36:43,990 --> 01:36:40,960
this experiment uh had to do with

2437
01:36:46,629 --> 01:36:44,000
communicating with these non-humans who

2438
01:36:47,510 --> 01:36:46,639
were fifth and sixth dimensional beings

2439
01:36:50,470 --> 01:36:47,520
so we couldn't

2440
01:36:51,990 --> 01:36:50,480
see them but we could feel them we had a

2441
01:36:55,109 --> 01:36:52,000
very strong magnetic

2442
01:36:58,790 --> 01:36:55,119
kind of our electromagnetic tingling

2443
01:37:01,910 --> 01:36:58,800
through our bodies and we could measure

2444
01:37:03,510 --> 01:37:01,920
that the rise in the part of the room

2445
01:37:06,870 --> 01:37:03,520
that they were standing in

2446
01:37:09,270 --> 01:37:06,880
as well but then

2447
01:37:11,109 --> 01:37:09,280
um we learned how to communicate with

2448
01:37:14,629 --> 01:37:11,119
them individually

2449
01:37:15,350 --> 01:37:14,639
and one came to me i communicated with

2450
01:37:17,910 --> 01:37:15,360
him

2451
01:37:18,790 --> 01:37:17,920
and i wrote down everything that he told

2452
01:37:21,590 --> 01:37:18,800
me

2453
01:37:22,070 --> 01:37:21,600
and it's a good thing i did because when

2454
01:37:25,590 --> 01:37:22,080
he

2455
01:37:28,709 --> 01:37:25,600
was gone i completely forgot about

2456
01:37:30,790 --> 01:37:28,719
what he said i knew it had happened but

2457
01:37:34,070 --> 01:37:30,800
i couldn't remember a thing

2458
01:37:35,109 --> 01:37:34,080
if i hadn't written it down um i

2459
01:37:37,430 --> 01:37:35,119
wouldn't have known

2460
01:37:39,109 --> 01:37:37,440
and my husband was with me when this was

2461
01:37:42,390 --> 01:37:39,119
occurring

2462
01:37:44,950 --> 01:37:42,400
so very strange so i wonder if it's that

2463
01:37:48,149 --> 01:37:44,960
powerful electromagnetic field

2464
01:37:51,750 --> 01:37:48,159
that has a lot to do with uh

2465
01:37:56,070 --> 01:37:54,640
experiences quite a lot

2466
01:37:57,350 --> 01:37:56,080
[Music]

2467
01:38:00,070 --> 01:37:57,360
anything else rob that's very

2468
01:38:01,030 --> 01:38:00,080
interesting no that's everything thank

2469
01:38:03,510 --> 01:38:01,040
you kathleen

2470
01:38:05,350 --> 01:38:03,520
and martin that's great all right thank

2471
01:38:07,830 --> 01:38:05,360
you for the call

2472
01:38:09,270 --> 01:38:07,840
so the lines are wide open and i hope

2473
01:38:12,550 --> 01:38:09,280
this doesn't happen next week

2474
01:38:15,350 --> 01:38:12,560
for long eight five five four seven two

2475
01:38:16,709 --> 01:38:15,360
five four eight three and uh bill is

2476
01:38:20,790 --> 01:38:16,719
standing by

2477
01:38:23,830 --> 01:38:20,800
and um let's see

2478
01:38:27,109 --> 01:38:23,840
when when um they were

2479
01:38:30,950 --> 01:38:27,119
uh betty and barney when they were

2480
01:38:33,030 --> 01:38:30,960
like say four four years after this

2481
01:38:34,870 --> 01:38:33,040
i know you said i think it was 1990s

2482
01:38:38,629 --> 01:38:34,880
when uh barney passed away

2483
01:38:40,390 --> 01:38:38,639
right um but just died in 1969

2484
01:38:43,510 --> 01:38:40,400
oh that's right that was right that's

2485
01:38:46,229 --> 01:38:43,520
right at 46 years old terribly young

2486
01:38:47,030 --> 01:38:46,239
before he died though were they asked to

2487
01:38:50,470 --> 01:38:47,040
speak

2488
01:38:51,430 --> 01:38:50,480
at uh in interviews like on tv or things

2489
01:38:54,149 --> 01:38:51,440
like that when this

2490
01:38:54,950 --> 01:38:54,159
got out well after the interrupted

2491
01:38:58,950 --> 01:38:54,960
journey was

2492
01:39:00,709 --> 01:38:58,960
published they were um

2493
01:39:02,629 --> 01:39:00,719
under an agreement that they would

2494
01:39:05,030 --> 01:39:02,639
publicize that book

2495
01:39:05,830 --> 01:39:05,040
so they were on television to tell the

2496
01:39:12,870 --> 01:39:05,840
truth

2497
01:39:13,990 --> 01:39:12,880
link letter um they were on a variety of

2498
01:39:17,109 --> 01:39:14,000
different shows

2499
01:39:18,870 --> 01:39:17,119
radio shows and television shows

2500
01:39:21,189 --> 01:39:18,880
and how did they handle that were they

2501
01:39:23,510 --> 01:39:21,199
okay with doing those type of things

2502
01:39:25,590 --> 01:39:23,520
um they seemed to be it took up time

2503
01:39:28,870 --> 01:39:25,600
they had to take time off from work

2504
01:39:31,510 --> 01:39:28,880
to do it but uh they seemed

2505
01:39:32,870 --> 01:39:31,520
okay they had sort of memorized what

2506
01:39:36,790 --> 01:39:32,880
they were going to say

2507
01:39:40,790 --> 01:39:36,800
they said the same thing every time

2508
01:39:43,189 --> 01:39:40,800
right right um so uh this question here

2509
01:39:46,390 --> 01:39:43,199
uh please put your questions in caps

2510
01:39:47,669 --> 01:39:46,400
um what's your uh i don't know if you

2511
01:39:50,310 --> 01:39:47,679
want to comment on this

2512
01:39:51,750 --> 01:39:50,320
or not but what is your uh opinion on dr

2513
01:39:55,189 --> 01:39:51,760
jacob's conclusion

2514
01:39:57,910 --> 01:39:55,199
ricard regarding et the ufo phenomenon

2515
01:39:59,590 --> 01:39:57,920
and what i know of that or maybe i'm

2516
01:40:03,109 --> 01:39:59,600
thinking of someone else

2517
01:40:05,669 --> 01:40:03,119
isn't he saying um there's a lot of um

2518
01:40:06,310 --> 01:40:05,679
hybrids like among us and that type of

2519
01:40:09,510 --> 01:40:06,320
thing

2520
01:40:10,790 --> 01:40:09,520
yes and they want to supplant us um the

2521
01:40:13,590 --> 01:40:10,800
insectoid the

2522
01:40:14,550 --> 01:40:13,600
the he calls them insectilins the mantis

2523
01:40:17,830 --> 01:40:14,560
types

2524
01:40:18,790 --> 01:40:17,840
and david and i uh have david jacobs and

2525
01:40:22,149 --> 01:40:18,800
i have discussed

2526
01:40:24,870 --> 01:40:22,159
this at length together and at

2527
01:40:27,189 --> 01:40:24,880
conferences and on the telephone

2528
01:40:28,950 --> 01:40:27,199
we have a friendly professional

2529
01:40:32,229 --> 01:40:28,960
relationship

2530
01:40:35,669 --> 01:40:32,239
we agree that

2531
01:40:40,229 --> 01:40:35,679
there is a hybridization program

2532
01:40:44,470 --> 01:40:40,239
we i don't know if he agrees with me

2533
01:40:49,189 --> 01:40:44,480
that these hybrids of being born

2534
01:40:54,070 --> 01:40:52,229
he takes a negative view of it because

2535
01:40:54,790 --> 01:40:54,080
he thinks that they're here to supplant

2536
01:40:58,629 --> 01:40:54,800
us

2537
01:41:02,629 --> 01:40:58,639
i uh believe that they are here

2538
01:41:05,830 --> 01:41:02,639
uh to attempt to save us from ourselves

2539
01:41:06,950 --> 01:41:05,840
and to save this planet yeah do you

2540
01:41:09,430 --> 01:41:06,960
think um

2541
01:41:10,950 --> 01:41:09,440
but what would it take you know we had

2542
01:41:11,830 --> 01:41:10,960
if that's the case if that's what

2543
01:41:13,189 --> 01:41:11,840
they're really doing

2544
01:41:15,030 --> 01:41:13,199
you know it makes you wonder what would

2545
01:41:17,350 --> 01:41:15,040
it take because there's

2546
01:41:18,229 --> 01:41:17,360
for instance um you know nuclear

2547
01:41:20,870 --> 01:41:18,239
warheads

2548
01:41:22,149 --> 01:41:20,880
have been shut down um there's been so

2549
01:41:24,629 --> 01:41:22,159
many messages

2550
01:41:25,990 --> 01:41:24,639
uh that we better take care of the

2551
01:41:28,390 --> 01:41:26,000
planet i mean and

2552
01:41:29,030 --> 01:41:28,400
you hear that over and over and over

2553
01:41:32,149 --> 01:41:29,040
again

2554
01:41:33,910 --> 01:41:32,159
do you think that there can be any

2555
01:41:35,910 --> 01:41:33,920
impact from that or do you think people

2556
01:41:37,669 --> 01:41:35,920
are just saying oh everyone's crazy

2557
01:41:39,990 --> 01:41:37,679
you know like the general public will

2558
01:41:43,109 --> 01:41:40,000
never take that seriously

2559
01:41:45,189 --> 01:41:43,119
i think that if enough experiencers and

2560
01:41:47,109 --> 01:41:45,199
researchers this was all part of our

2561
01:41:50,070 --> 01:41:47,119
research studies as well

2562
01:41:51,669 --> 01:41:50,080
where we had open-ended questions did

2563
01:41:54,229 --> 01:41:51,679
the ets

2564
01:41:56,310 --> 01:41:54,239
give you any information and if they did

2565
01:42:00,149 --> 01:41:56,320
what was that information

2566
01:42:03,189 --> 01:42:00,159
so it was you know messages

2567
01:42:07,030 --> 01:42:03,199
repeated over and over again by

2568
01:42:10,870 --> 01:42:07,040
uh hundreds if not uh

2569
01:42:13,109 --> 01:42:10,880
uh experiencers who were given the same

2570
01:42:13,990 --> 01:42:13,119
message and bud hopkins used to write

2571
01:42:16,470 --> 01:42:14,000
about it

2572
01:42:17,669 --> 01:42:16,480
too that the message of uh the

2573
01:42:21,030 --> 01:42:17,679
destruction

2574
01:42:23,030 --> 01:42:21,040
of this planet that uh uh often

2575
01:42:26,390 --> 01:42:23,040
experiences are shown

2576
01:42:29,430 --> 01:42:26,400
uh holographic images are screen images

2577
01:42:32,470 --> 01:42:29,440
of uh the planet uh

2578
01:42:34,950 --> 01:42:32,480
under nuclear war people's faces melting

2579
01:42:38,870 --> 01:42:34,960
off that kind of thing horrifying

2580
01:42:41,590 --> 01:42:38,880
images but the uh ets have

2581
01:42:42,790 --> 01:42:41,600
wanted humans uh who they've been in

2582
01:42:46,390 --> 01:42:42,800
contact with

2583
01:42:49,990 --> 01:42:46,400
to spread this message unfortunately

2584
01:42:54,390 --> 01:42:50,000
there was such a disinformation program

2585
01:42:56,310 --> 01:42:54,400
and experiencers who went forward

2586
01:42:57,750 --> 01:42:56,320
suffered for the rest of their lives

2587
01:42:59,669 --> 01:42:57,760
from criticism

2588
01:43:01,109 --> 01:42:59,679
from people making fun of them the

2589
01:43:04,310 --> 01:43:01,119
federal government

2590
01:43:05,990 --> 01:43:04,320
uh cast experiencers and you and even

2591
01:43:09,350 --> 01:43:06,000
ufo observers

2592
01:43:12,709 --> 01:43:09,360
in kind of a kooky light and

2593
01:43:16,229 --> 01:43:12,719
so uh that i think is changing

2594
01:43:19,830 --> 01:43:16,239
now it's being taken more seriously

2595
01:43:22,270 --> 01:43:19,840
uh i think as a result of all of the

2596
01:43:24,390 --> 01:43:22,280
studies that have been done on

2597
01:43:27,430 --> 01:43:24,400
experiences there are many

2598
01:43:31,189 --> 01:43:27,440
credible people there are military

2599
01:43:34,709 --> 01:43:31,199
officers many who have been abducted and

2600
01:43:36,870 --> 01:43:34,719
uh i have spoken with them

2601
01:43:38,070 --> 01:43:36,880
uh they've contacted me i've hypnotized

2602
01:43:41,109 --> 01:43:38,080
some of them even

2603
01:43:43,750 --> 01:43:41,119
they will always remain silent i believe

2604
01:43:44,229 --> 01:43:43,760
but i can tell you that there are many

2605
01:43:47,189 --> 01:43:44,239
many

2606
01:43:48,229 --> 01:43:47,199
credible people who have had these

2607
01:43:51,430 --> 01:43:48,239
experiences

2608
01:43:53,910 --> 01:43:51,440
stable people and uh

2609
01:43:54,470 --> 01:43:53,920
it's important for that message to get

2610
01:43:56,709 --> 01:43:54,480
out

2611
01:43:57,990 --> 01:43:56,719
and i'm just hoping that more and more

2612
01:44:01,990 --> 01:43:58,000
experiences since

2613
01:44:04,830 --> 01:44:02,000
i'm speaking about the findings of

2614
01:44:06,550 --> 01:44:04,840
of our studies of more than 5 000

2615
01:44:09,430 --> 01:44:06,560
experiences errors

2616
01:44:10,870 --> 01:44:09,440
that we will that this message will be

2617
01:44:13,750 --> 01:44:10,880
carried further

2618
01:44:14,070 --> 01:44:13,760
than it has in the past you know it's

2619
01:44:19,430 --> 01:44:14,080
still

2620
01:44:20,709 --> 01:44:19,440
i mean you know i mean the question

2621
01:44:22,790 --> 01:44:20,719
someone might ask well

2622
01:44:24,070 --> 01:44:22,800
why doesn't why don't they abduct a

2623
01:44:26,550 --> 01:44:24,080
senator or

2624
01:44:27,109 --> 01:44:26,560
you know a supreme court judge or

2625
01:44:30,149 --> 01:44:27,119
someone

2626
01:44:32,070 --> 01:44:30,159
like that and you know if you if if that

2627
01:44:34,950 --> 01:44:32,080
was the case and they brought

2628
01:44:36,390 --> 01:44:34,960
something up publicly um their career

2629
01:44:39,510 --> 01:44:36,400
would be ruined

2630
01:44:40,950 --> 01:44:39,520
you know i mean maybe not maybe not a

2631
01:44:42,070 --> 01:44:40,960
justice because i think that's a

2632
01:44:43,830 --> 01:44:42,080
lifelong

2633
01:44:45,510 --> 01:44:43,840
like a tenure there where nothing can

2634
01:44:47,910 --> 01:44:45,520
really happen to them unless

2635
01:44:48,550 --> 01:44:47,920
they do something illegal but um but

2636
01:44:51,510 --> 01:44:48,560
still

2637
01:44:53,590 --> 01:44:51,520
their reputation would be soiled by it

2638
01:44:54,310 --> 01:44:53,600
absolutely and they might have abducted

2639
01:44:58,390 --> 01:44:54,320
the head of

2640
01:45:01,350 --> 01:44:58,400
the of uh the uni the united nations

2641
01:45:03,590 --> 01:45:01,360
but hopkins wrote about that yeah and

2642
01:45:06,790 --> 01:45:03,600
and further investigation

2643
01:45:10,310 --> 01:45:06,800
uh went on about that um

2644
01:45:13,590 --> 01:45:10,320
there was uh the former prime minister

2645
01:45:17,270 --> 01:45:13,600
of uh grenada who

2646
01:45:20,149 --> 01:45:17,280
had an encounter with non-humans on

2647
01:45:21,109 --> 01:45:20,159
a beach there and spoke to the united

2648
01:45:23,669 --> 01:45:21,119
nations

2649
01:45:24,470 --> 01:45:23,679
about that too that was through lee

2650
01:45:27,590 --> 01:45:24,480
spiegel

2651
01:45:29,669 --> 01:45:27,600
um was involved in that one yes uh years

2652
01:45:31,669 --> 01:45:29,679
ago in the 70s late 70s

2653
01:45:32,870 --> 01:45:31,679
yeah fascinating and the other one that

2654
01:45:35,990 --> 01:45:32,880
bud hopkins

2655
01:45:38,950 --> 01:45:36,000
wrote about um was also

2656
01:45:40,950 --> 01:45:38,960
someone i spoke to ralph blumenthal that

2657
01:45:45,510 --> 01:45:40,960
john mack

2658
01:45:49,350 --> 01:45:45,520
another caller here we're going to bring

2659
01:45:51,590 --> 01:45:49,360
that person on and we have lauren

2660
01:45:53,350 --> 01:45:51,600
from connecticut lauren welcome to the

2661
01:45:56,310 --> 01:45:53,360
show

2662
01:45:58,709 --> 01:45:56,320
yes thank you hi martin hi kathleen hi

2663
01:46:01,910 --> 01:45:58,719
there welcome

2664
01:46:05,350 --> 01:46:01,920
i was wondering um when

2665
01:46:08,870 --> 01:46:05,360
kathleen when you said that the um

2666
01:46:11,990 --> 01:46:08,880
aliens are trying to get us to

2667
01:46:14,870 --> 01:46:12,000
take care of our earth better

2668
01:46:16,709 --> 01:46:14,880
what if we don't what if they feel that

2669
01:46:17,669 --> 01:46:16,719
my goodness these people just aren't

2670
01:46:20,149 --> 01:46:17,679
getting it

2671
01:46:23,189 --> 01:46:20,159
what would be their next step what would

2672
01:46:25,270 --> 01:46:23,199
they give us an ultimatum or would they

2673
01:46:26,709 --> 01:46:25,280
take over the planet what what are your

2674
01:46:29,750 --> 01:46:26,719
thoughts on that

2675
01:46:32,470 --> 01:46:29,760
they have a non-interference policy

2676
01:46:33,430 --> 01:46:32,480
uh the only time that they would

2677
01:46:36,870 --> 01:46:33,440
interfere

2678
01:46:39,990 --> 01:46:36,880
they have told experiencers is uh

2679
01:46:43,270 --> 01:46:40,000
if we uh were at the beginning

2680
01:46:46,470 --> 01:46:43,280
of nuclear war and they would try

2681
01:46:48,629 --> 01:46:46,480
to to stop it at that time but they have

2682
01:46:51,189 --> 01:46:48,639
a non-interference policy

2683
01:46:52,070 --> 01:46:51,199
because they fear that if they do show

2684
01:46:54,229 --> 01:46:52,080
up in large

2685
01:46:55,669 --> 01:46:54,239
numbers that it will be interpreted

2686
01:46:58,550 --> 01:46:55,679
around the world as an

2687
01:47:00,790 --> 01:46:58,560
invasion there will be military action

2688
01:47:03,669 --> 01:47:00,800
they're militarily superior to

2689
01:47:05,669 --> 01:47:03,679
us and it could uh be very bad for the

2690
01:47:07,830 --> 01:47:05,679
people of earth so they don't want that

2691
01:47:10,070 --> 01:47:07,840
to happen

2692
01:47:11,590 --> 01:47:10,080
oh okay well thank you very much i

2693
01:47:14,310 --> 01:47:11,600
appreciate it

2694
01:47:16,229 --> 01:47:14,320
thank you lauren yeah well i could

2695
01:47:19,750 --> 01:47:16,239
definitely understand that with our

2696
01:47:21,990 --> 01:47:19,760
with our history of uh warfare

2697
01:47:25,189 --> 01:47:22,000
um i think we've there's something like

2698
01:47:27,830 --> 01:47:25,199
over 350 000 wars on record

2699
01:47:28,310 --> 01:47:27,840
um you know in history which is pretty

2700
01:47:31,109 --> 01:47:28,320
sad

2701
01:47:32,229 --> 01:47:31,119
and scary yeah so we're not exactly kind

2702
01:47:34,550 --> 01:47:32,239
to each other

2703
01:47:35,990 --> 01:47:34,560
during the 20th century we killed almost

2704
01:47:38,790 --> 01:47:36,000
200 million of our

2705
01:47:39,510 --> 01:47:38,800
own kind the 20th is the worst of all on

2706
01:47:41,669 --> 01:47:39,520
record

2707
01:47:43,590 --> 01:47:41,679
and people don't realize that they think

2708
01:47:44,149 --> 01:47:43,600
you know the barbarian times or whatever

2709
01:47:46,310 --> 01:47:44,159
but

2710
01:47:48,470 --> 01:47:46,320
no that 20th century was the most brutal

2711
01:47:51,669 --> 01:47:48,480
i had a historian on another show i do

2712
01:47:53,350 --> 01:47:51,679
that talked about that yeah yeah that's

2713
01:47:56,709 --> 01:47:53,360
what we do

2714
01:47:58,629 --> 01:47:56,719
so hopefully the 21st uh that

2715
01:48:00,149 --> 01:47:58,639
will be a little better this uh this

2716
01:48:04,870 --> 01:48:00,159
century and the

2717
01:48:09,030 --> 01:48:07,510
yes um i have mentioned this many times

2718
01:48:10,390 --> 01:48:09,040
but for the person who's never heard me

2719
01:48:13,430 --> 01:48:10,400
say it before

2720
01:48:15,669 --> 01:48:13,440
that i had a uh insurance long before i

2721
01:48:17,990 --> 01:48:15,679
was really looking into the topic

2722
01:48:20,310 --> 01:48:18,000
in the 90s i looked into it a little bit

2723
01:48:22,070 --> 01:48:20,320
i mean just on the outside like if some

2724
01:48:24,070 --> 01:48:22,080
saw something on tv or whatever i'd

2725
01:48:27,189 --> 01:48:24,080
watch it but i mean i had a

2726
01:48:27,830 --> 01:48:27,199
i had a insurance broker tell me um that

2727
01:48:31,669 --> 01:48:27,840
he was

2728
01:48:34,629 --> 01:48:31,679
in vietnam and uh during the vietnam

2729
01:48:35,109 --> 01:48:34,639
war and he was he worked for a special

2730
01:48:38,629 --> 01:48:35,119
um

2731
01:48:40,310 --> 01:48:38,639
investigated ufos

2732
01:48:42,790 --> 01:48:40,320
that's exactly what he told me and you

2733
01:48:44,550 --> 01:48:42,800
know i of course i couldn't verify that

2734
01:48:47,030 --> 01:48:44,560
he talked about nuclear weapons he

2735
01:48:49,109 --> 01:48:47,040
talked about all kinds of things and

2736
01:48:50,470 --> 01:48:49,119
i've been trying to figure out how to

2737
01:48:52,070 --> 01:48:50,480
get a hold of him i haven't been able to

2738
01:48:53,350 --> 01:48:52,080
find him i'd love to talk to him again

2739
01:48:56,870 --> 01:48:53,360
about that

2740
01:48:59,430 --> 01:48:56,880
but uh and anyway uh we have

2741
01:49:00,629 --> 01:48:59,440
five minutes left to the show so if you

2742
01:49:03,350 --> 01:49:00,639
would like to call in

2743
01:49:05,629 --> 01:49:03,360
uh now so now's the time to call in that

2744
01:49:10,390 --> 01:49:07,990
855-472-5483 we can take one more

2745
01:49:11,350 --> 01:49:10,400
caller if you'd like to give us a ring

2746
01:49:15,109 --> 01:49:11,360
um

2747
01:49:16,629 --> 01:49:15,119
so in the uh 60th anniversary that's out

2748
01:49:19,750 --> 01:49:16,639
now i have it uh

2749
01:49:22,310 --> 01:49:19,760
i have the link up on on the website and

2750
01:49:23,669 --> 01:49:22,320
is that is that something that when they

2751
01:49:26,470 --> 01:49:23,679
republish something

2752
01:49:27,030 --> 01:49:26,480
like a new edition is it a hard sell or

2753
01:49:30,550 --> 01:49:27,040
do you

2754
01:49:32,629 --> 01:49:30,560
out of it

2755
01:49:33,589 --> 01:49:32,639
i've gotten loads of book sales out of

2756
01:49:35,669 --> 01:49:33,599
it excellent

2757
01:49:36,870 --> 01:49:35,679
yes and um i'm trying to push it to

2758
01:49:38,709 --> 01:49:36,880
number one the

2759
01:49:40,149 --> 01:49:38,719
the first book was the number one best

2760
01:49:43,910 --> 01:49:40,159
seller it was

2761
01:49:47,189 --> 01:49:43,920
really wow yeah i'm hoping

2762
01:49:50,310 --> 01:49:47,199
that uh people will help me to make the

2763
01:49:51,109 --> 01:49:50,320
60th anniversary uh one a best seller

2764
01:49:54,229 --> 01:49:51,119
too

2765
01:49:55,430 --> 01:49:54,239
yeah and that's on amazon and it's a

2766
01:49:58,310 --> 01:49:55,440
little you just have to

2767
01:49:59,430 --> 01:49:58,320
look the cover is almost identical

2768
01:50:01,350 --> 01:49:59,440
except it has

2769
01:50:02,550 --> 01:50:01,360
again i'll show it again um for those

2770
01:50:05,510 --> 01:50:02,560
people on

2771
01:50:07,189 --> 01:50:05,520
uh youtube and facebook and twitch um

2772
01:50:07,910 --> 01:50:07,199
the only difference is between the two

2773
01:50:10,950 --> 01:50:07,920
books

2774
01:50:11,669 --> 01:50:10,960
is you see the 60th anniversary the

2775
01:50:13,750 --> 01:50:11,679
little uh

2776
01:50:15,830 --> 01:50:13,760
pendant at the top this is the original

2777
01:50:19,030 --> 01:50:15,840
and this is the 60th

2778
01:50:21,430 --> 01:50:19,040
so uh yeah yeah a great book uh let's

2779
01:50:23,270 --> 01:50:21,440
see i think we might have one more

2780
01:50:25,350 --> 01:50:23,280
oh nope someone just says they bought

2781
01:50:28,550 --> 01:50:25,360
your book just now

2782
01:50:29,830 --> 01:50:28,560
uh actually bill bill who's answering

2783
01:50:31,589 --> 01:50:29,840
the phone about your book

2784
01:50:33,430 --> 01:50:31,599
so he's going to read it that's awesome

2785
01:50:37,350 --> 01:50:33,440
so you made one sale tonight

2786
01:50:42,470 --> 01:50:39,750
so a lot of times people will bring up

2787
01:50:44,310 --> 01:50:42,480
this topic and i just want to hear your

2788
01:50:45,910 --> 01:50:44,320
your answer to it because people will

2789
01:50:47,270 --> 01:50:45,920
say to me often why do you talk about

2790
01:50:51,589 --> 01:50:47,280
the old cases

2791
01:50:53,669 --> 01:50:51,599
um and so i i say a lot of times

2792
01:50:55,270 --> 01:50:53,679
even though a case is old a lot of times

2793
01:50:58,950 --> 01:50:55,280
new information

2794
01:51:02,229 --> 01:50:58,960
is found and how do you feel about that

2795
01:51:06,070 --> 01:51:02,239
i i agree i consistently

2796
01:51:07,990 --> 01:51:06,080
look for additional scientific evidence

2797
01:51:09,350 --> 01:51:08,000
in the betty and barney hill case and

2798
01:51:12,070 --> 01:51:09,360
we've found uh

2799
01:51:12,870 --> 01:51:12,080
a lot of new evidence over the past 13

2800
01:51:15,430 --> 01:51:12,880
years

2801
01:51:16,709 --> 01:51:15,440
ah yeah i we have we do have another

2802
01:51:19,750 --> 01:51:16,719
caller

2803
01:51:21,910 --> 01:51:19,760
and it looks like uh joelle uh

2804
01:51:24,870 --> 01:51:21,920
is calling from massachusetts welcome to

2805
01:51:29,189 --> 01:51:27,750
yes hello um i have a question for

2806
01:51:32,070 --> 01:51:29,199
kathleen

2807
01:51:34,950 --> 01:51:32,080
really quickly um did you ever have the

2808
01:51:36,070 --> 01:51:34,960
opportunity to speak directly with dr

2809
01:51:40,470 --> 01:51:36,080
simon

2810
01:51:44,470 --> 01:51:40,480
regarding your um you're on uncle's case

2811
01:51:45,589 --> 01:51:44,480
particularly you know i was reading the

2812
01:51:50,070 --> 01:51:45,599
foreword

2813
01:51:53,669 --> 01:51:50,080
recently of interrupted journey and

2814
01:51:56,470 --> 01:51:53,679
he had a different conclusion about

2815
01:51:58,470 --> 01:51:56,480
their experience and i'm just wondering

2816
01:52:01,189 --> 01:51:58,480
if you ever had the opportunity

2817
01:52:02,629 --> 01:52:01,199
again doing your research and i'll hang

2818
01:52:05,990 --> 01:52:02,639
up to listen

2819
01:52:06,950 --> 01:52:06,000
thank you joel thank you dr simon was

2820
01:52:09,589 --> 01:52:06,960
quite old

2821
01:52:10,550 --> 01:52:09,599
when i met him for the first time i i

2822
01:52:13,510 --> 01:52:10,560
went to

2823
01:52:15,109 --> 01:52:13,520
his home and had dinner with betty and

2824
01:52:18,870 --> 01:52:15,119
barney and alan heineck and

2825
01:52:22,550 --> 01:52:18,880
and john fuller um so uh

2826
01:52:26,950 --> 01:52:22,560
as i was about 18 19 years old

2827
01:52:28,870 --> 01:52:26,960
uh and i i did not speak with him

2828
01:52:31,830 --> 01:52:28,880
because i felt like i was the child in

2829
01:52:34,790 --> 01:52:31,840
the room at that time

2830
01:52:37,350 --> 01:52:34,800
i did a comparative analysis of betty's

2831
01:52:40,550 --> 01:52:37,360
and barney's statements

2832
01:52:43,109 --> 01:52:40,560
under hypnosis as compared to

2833
01:52:44,790 --> 01:52:43,119
betty's dreams and that was dr simon's

2834
01:52:48,070 --> 01:52:44,800
hypothesis

2835
01:52:50,550 --> 01:52:48,080
he didn't know this for certain but he

2836
01:52:51,189 --> 01:52:50,560
i have a letter he wrote to betty and he

2837
01:52:54,790 --> 01:52:51,199
said

2838
01:52:57,990 --> 01:52:54,800
well i i have to do this because

2839
01:52:59,910 --> 01:52:58,000
uh we don't have scientific evidence so

2840
01:53:02,790 --> 01:52:59,920
i'm taking this stance

2841
01:53:03,510 --> 01:53:02,800
uh and until there is scientific

2842
01:53:06,550 --> 01:53:03,520
evidence

2843
01:53:08,950 --> 01:53:06,560
regarding ufos and contact

2844
01:53:10,070 --> 01:53:08,960
uh that never came in his lifetime i

2845
01:53:13,189 --> 01:53:10,080
don't believe

2846
01:53:15,350 --> 01:53:13,199
but um because the

2847
01:53:16,870 --> 01:53:15,360
most of the evidence in this case came

2848
01:53:19,990 --> 01:53:16,880
later um

2849
01:53:23,589 --> 01:53:20,000
but i did that comparative analysis

2850
01:53:26,870 --> 01:53:23,599
uh sentence by sentence and

2851
01:53:27,669 --> 01:53:26,880
it's all in captured i didn't make it

2852
01:53:30,790 --> 01:53:27,679
boring

2853
01:53:31,910 --> 01:53:30,800
i just told what happened and compared

2854
01:53:34,310 --> 01:53:31,920
it to

2855
01:53:35,669 --> 01:53:34,320
the the content of betty's dream as

2856
01:53:38,149 --> 01:53:35,679
opposed to

2857
01:53:40,950 --> 01:53:38,159
what each of them said individually

2858
01:53:42,709 --> 01:53:40,960
under hypnosis kathleen it's been a real

2859
01:53:44,870 --> 01:53:42,719
pleasure we are at the end of our show

2860
01:53:46,550 --> 01:53:44,880
thank you so much very nice to be with

2861
01:53:50,229 --> 01:53:46,560
you again mark yes

2862
01:53:51,189 --> 01:53:50,239
and again kathleen uh dash is it dasher

2863
01:53:54,229 --> 01:53:51,199
underscore dash

2864
01:53:56,550 --> 01:53:54,239
yes martin.com thanks so much and

2865
01:53:57,589 --> 01:53:56,560
i hope you pushed the number one you

2866
01:54:00,310 --> 01:53:57,599
take care

2867
01:54:01,910 --> 01:54:00,320
all right yeah good night all right

2868
01:54:03,830 --> 01:54:01,920
everyone so that's it for this show

2869
01:54:04,950 --> 01:54:03,840
thank you so much and remember to come

2870
01:54:07,990 --> 01:54:04,960
back next week

2871
01:54:09,350 --> 01:54:08,000
we have the call in show and

2872
01:54:11,189 --> 01:54:09,360
think of an experience you'd like to

2873
01:54:12,790 --> 01:54:11,199
call about or

2874
01:54:14,229 --> 01:54:12,800
you just want to call and talk about a

2875
01:54:16,310 --> 01:54:14,239
ufo citing any of that

2876
01:54:18,229 --> 01:54:16,320
so thank you so much and remember to

2877
01:54:30,780 --> 01:54:18,239
keep your eyes to the sky see you next